From: https://youtube.com/watch?v=LvkDipkCvZ4

Context: Throughout this transcript, Bhante Vimalaramsi is the speaker unless otherwise indicated.

me

[Music]

so today we are going to be reading from

majamanikaya 18

madhu pindika suta the honey ball

thus have i heard on one occasion the

blessed one was living in the sakyan

country at kapalavatu in negrodus park

kapalavatu was

the buddha's

birthplace or place where he grew up

and

that is now located in modern day nepal

then when it was morning the blessed one

dressed and taking his bowl and outer

robe went into kapalavatu for alms

when he had wandered for arms in

kapalavatu and had returned from his

arms round

after his meal he went to the great wood

for the days abiding

and entering the great wood sat down at

the root of a bilva

sapling for the days abiding

the day's abiding that is what you guys

are doing all day long meditating

so that could be four hours that could

be six hours that could be eight hours

it could be twelve hours

while walking and wandering for exercise

also went to the great wood

and when he had entered the great wood

he went to the bilva sapling where the

blessed one was and exchange great

greetings with him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished

he stood at one side leaning on his stok

stick

and asked the blessed one

what does the recluse assert what does

he proclaim

dandapani

he was this

well

he was the buddha's father-in-law

and he had a

chip on his shoulder because obviously

the buddha when he was the bodhisattva

left you know in the middle of the night

his wife who was stunned upon his

daughter

and the one the reason why he's called

dandapani is because he had this great

golden stick

danda means stick

and he would walk around with that stick

and

later on when the buddha's cousin

devadat

devadatta

created the schism

dandapani decided to side

with devadatta

so

he always didn't like the buddha for

for many different reasons

so when he says what does the recluse

assert what does he proclaim

really what he's saying is what are you

about you know he's he's being rude to

the buddha obnoxious to the buddha

what are you talking about you know that

kind of attitude what do you know

so the buddha says

friend

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way

that one does not quarrel with anyone in

the world with its gods

its maras and its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas

its princes and its people

in such a way that perceptions no more

underlie that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity

shorn of worry

free from craving

for any kind of being

so let's separate that statement a

little bit because this whole suta is

actually an elaboration of that

statement but i'll give you a little

brief understanding of what he's saying

here

first and foremost he says

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way that one does not quarrel

with anyone in this world

it's a direct answer to dhandapani who

is looking to argue with the buddha

who's looking to debate with the buddha

who's looking to

quarrel with the buddha

and the buddha says that my teaching is

such that i don't quarrel with anyone

my teaching is not for debating

my teaching the dhamma

is not for having arguments about what

is right and what is wrong

what is the dhamma and what is not the

dhamma

so he teaches in such a way

that perceptions no more underlie that

brahman

when he says brahman he's not talking

about the brahmanas in terms of the

priest class

of ancient india

he's talking about the brahman from what

it means really the word brahman what it

means to be realized to be awakened so

the awakened one the buddha he's

referring to himself

or in arahat

the brahmana

so the perceptions the sensual

perceptions or let's say this

perceptions in general no more underlie

that person who abides detached from

sensual pleasures

he no longer has sensual craving

without perplexity

he no longer has doubt the fetter of

doubt

shorn of worry he no longer has any kind

of restlessness

and free from craving for any kind of

being

so this is just a summation a summary

of having destroyed all ten fetters

let go of any kind of doubt

let go of any sensual craving and in

turn any kind of aversion

let go of restlessness let go of conceit

let go of all views

and let go of any craving for existence

or non-existence

when this was said dandapani the sakyan

what do you think dhandarpani would have

done when he heard this

he shook his head

wagged his tongue

and raised his eyebrows until his

forehead was puckered in three lines

then he departed leaning on his stick so

obviously he wasn't happy with that

answer

then when it was evening the blessed one

rose from meditation and went to

negrodus park

where he sat down on a seat made ready

for him

and told the bakus what had taken place

then a certain bhikkhu asked the blessed

one

but venerable sir how does the blessed

one assert and proclaim his teaching in

such a way

that he does not quarrel with anyone in

this world with its gods its maras and

its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas its princes and its people

and venerable sir

how is it that perceptions no more

underlie the blessed one that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity shorn of worry

free from craving for any kind of being

now listen to what he says

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust

of the underlying tendency to aversion

of the underlying tendency to views

of the underlying tendency to doubt

of the underlying tendency to conceit

of the underlying tendency to desire for

being

of the underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to

rods and weapons

of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here these evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder

so he says

[Music]

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

beset a person

so

how does mental proliferation arise

first of all what is mental

proliferation

mental proliferation is that example

that venerable metananda gave us

yesterday where he was thinking about

something and then it led to another

thought and then it led to another

thought and then led to another thought

and now you're all over the place you're

clinging to this side here you're

clinging to that idea

and you want to do this you want to do

that and then there's bhava and then

that could lead to some kind of birth of

action

so mental proliferation is three part

it's the initial craving that arises

right so that craving that we talk about

the link of craving

that arises dependent upon feeling

so that craving can be

sensual craving you hear something and

that triggers a memory

and then you cling to that memory so

that's the clinging and you think about

that memory and you say oh yeah i was

this in that memory or i wonder what

would happen if we did it differently

you know all of these thoughts that

arise so that's the bhava that's the

becoming

or it could be craving for existence or

craving for non-existence now any of

these types of craving are dependent

upon feeling

now in that feeling we have threefold

right there's three kinds of feeling

there's pleasant feeling

there's painful feeling and there's

neither painful nor pleasant feeling

these are the three tones of any kind of

experience

so

when there is a pleasant feeling

right you see something beautiful

you hear something wonderful

you taste something delicious

you smell something fragrant

you have a very comfortable sitting

posture it's all very pleasant

if you identify with that experience

if you take that experience personally

that pleasant experience

what can arise as a result

in that is the underlying tendency

to craving

this is the bridge these underlying

tendencies that we talked about now he

just talked about the seven underlying

tendencies

these underlie an experience

pleasant painful or neutral

so if it's pleasant it can give rise

if you identify with it

if you say this is me

this is mine this is myself the

underlying tendency to craving that's

that branch

that goes into full-blown link of

craving

that is where the the mental

proliferation begins

if it's a painful feeling

and you say i don't like it the initial

reaction in the mind is

oh i don't like this this is

uncomfortable

and then there's this taking it

personally the taking of it personally

what does that mean the taking of it

personally

how do you identify with something how

do you identify with a sensation

how do you identify with an experience

how does that happen

there's a sense of self-image that you

have

you create this idea that this is who i

am

you create this story in your mind of

this is me

these are my experiences these are my

memories

and you consolidate them into some kind

of sense of self

and this is always there this is the

underlying tendency to conceit

it's always there for somebody who is

not fully realized

and that underlying tendency to conceit

that's what says

that's what compares and contrasts all

the experiences

and the litmus test

right the the touchstone

is that sense of self that image that

you have about yourself

and then every experience is said to be

oh how does this affect that me

how does it affect the sense of me

and so if it says it's pleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

craving if it says it's unpleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

aversion

if it says

it's neutral i don't care about it there

can be the underlying tendency to

ignorance

now whether it's ignorance

or towards views

or doubt or conceit or the desire for

being

these can underlie

pleasant feeling painful feeling

or even neutral feeling

how how does the underlying tendency to

ignorance come about

the very fact that you take this thing

personally this experience personally

whether the experience is a sensory

experience

whether this experience is a meditative

experience whether this experience is

you know some imagination in your mind

whatever it might be

when you have that sense of self that

intrinsic sense of self of taking it

personally

that is where the conceit the underlying

tendency to conceit is

dependent upon that depending upon what

kind of feeling it is there can be the

underlying tendency to ignorance

what is ignorance

ignorance is

not being aware of the four noble truths

forgetting to six are

because

what are the four noble truths that

there is suffering

that there is a source or origin of this

suffering

that there is a cessation of that

suffering

and that there is a way leading to the

cessation of that suffering

now you have a pleasant feeling

or you have a hindrance that arises

you take that hindrance personally and

you say you judge yourself and you say

why am i feeling

this sensual craving or i don't like

that i'm feeling this way

or i don't like this particular

hindrance

and now you have mental proliferation

you have self-doubt which creates more

self-doubt

you have restlessness which creates more

restlessness every time you take it

personally

but if you recognize

the hindrance

that is recognizing the first noble

truth of suffering this hindrance is the

suffering

and then you release your attention from

that the undue attention to that

hindrance in the form of clinging to it

in the form of wanting to push it away

in the form of taking it personally

staying there the undo attention feeds

that hindrance further

so that is a type of craving that

reactivity to that you release that

you relax

when you relax

your mind becomes

free of any kind of craving

so it experiences

the third noble truth

of the cessation of craving which is the

cessation of suffering

then you come back to the smile and then

you come back to the object

this coming back to the smile coming

back to the object is the fourth noble

truth

the cultivation of the way leading

to the cessation of suffering

that is the eightfold path

because the six hours

is right effort

and right effort

is the core of the eightfold path

it is through right effort that you go

from the wrong view to right view

the wrong intention to right intention

the wrong speech to right speech

the wrong action to right action

the wrong livelihood to right livelihood

the wrong mindfulness to right

mindfulness

the wrong collectedness to right

collectiveness so using the six r's

at the experience whatever that

experience is

if you notice that the mind is clinging

to that experience if you notice that

the mind is becoming

engrossed in that experience identifying

with that experience

you recognize that

release your attention from that

relax

re-smile and return back

to that wholesome mindset

what about the underlying tendency to

doubts the underlying tendency to doubt

is about doubt in reference to what is

wholesome and what is unwholesome

what is the right path and what is the

wrong path

so

if there is an experience you might have

confusion about what to do with that

that's the perplexity am i meditating

am i in the first jhana

or am i in the seventh genre

am i experience equanimity

do i have a hindrance

i wonder if i'm doing this correctly

do i remember the instructions that were

given

all of these kinds of thoughts

this is the kind of underlying tendency

to doubt

right so there's an experience that you

have in meditation and you think wait is

this the right thing that i should be is

this the loving kindness that they were

talking about is this the equanimity

that i'm supposed to experience

all of these are the this is the

hindrance of doubt

right so let go of that let the

meditation flow stop trying to analyze

what's going on

stop trying to unnecessarily investigate

what's going on

the true understanding of investigation

of states is the understanding of what

is present and what is not present

what is present and what is not present

meaning you understand okay there is

present right now doubt

or there is present right now craving or

there is present right now

loving-kindness that's it

if there is doubt if there is craving if

there is restlessness

you six are

and come back to your object of

meditation what about views underlying

tendency to views

these views are about

you know

self-use

i am this or i am that

or this is me or this is mine

right this is related to conceit but

this is also related to self-view and

other kinds of wrong views

you know you kind of you try to justify

why is this there

you try to justify or analyze why is it

present why is it not present

right and then there's also underlying

tendencies to view in terms of if

something pleasant happen you'll say

oh i just got lucky

you know or you'll you'll identify with

it and say

oh i i don't know how this happened you

know there are these different kinds of

views that arise in reference to

feeling in reference to perception in

reference to the world and in reference

to self we'll talk about that when we

talk about clinging to views

right so it's a clinging to wrong kinds

of view

wrong kinds of view with the idea that

this was faded to happen that's a kind

of wrong view or the wrong view that i

have to do something about this by

purifying my karma

that's a ascetic kind of view

or there's nothing wrong with what i'm

doing even though you know it to be

wrong

there's that little nudge in your mind

that says this is probably not what you

should be doing and you'll say oh it's

no big deal nobody has to know

that's a different kind of wrong view

because you think oh nothing really

matters there's no

there's no karma here there's no cause

and consequence here that's a different

kind of wrong view

so these are the different kinds of

underlying tendency to views

what about the underlying tendency

to

the desire for being

the underlying tendency

to desire for being

that's

that means the desire to exist in a

certain kind of way

you have a pleasant feeling and you say

i hope this feeling doesn't stop

you experience loving kindness and you

say

i hope i can stay with this loving

kindness

as soon as a loving kindness fades away

you say what

happened you know i you try to hold on

to that

in this meditation you don't hold on to

anything

the objective is not to hold on to

anything

the object of meditation is a

is a

is a means for your mind to be stable

it's a means for your mind to be

collected to be centered

so which means that you're just using it

to let your mind be collected

the unification of mind

anything beyond that where you try to

hold on to the object

is a underlying tendency to desire for

being

[Music]

so joy comes up and you say oh the joy

dissipated i must be doing something

wrong

right so let go of any attachment to how

things should be

or how things should not be that's

another kind of desire for being

right it's like

i don't want to be in this particular

retreat or i don't want to be doing this

or i don't want to be doing that i don't

want to be

that's the beginning of desire for

non-existence

so let go of attachment to any kind of

experience

in this retreat make it a point to just

allow experiences to flow

without identifying with them

be like that

you know that audience who's just

watching a movie just playing out

a movie

don't get caught up in what's going on

in the movie

the movie may be interesting maybe

pleasant maybe unpleasant

you know it might be a romance it might

be a drama it might be a comedy it might

be a horror

whatever kind of film it is

just watch it

don't get engrossed in it

right it's just a movie just watch

everything as it is

without identifying with it without

supplanting that sense of this is me

this is mine this is myself

to that experience

whether it's right now

or whether it's when you're meditating

just let everything

flow as soon as you try to hold on to it

there the craving arises that's the

underlying tendency that gives rise to

the full-blown craving and that craving

then gives rise to clinging and that

clinging gives rise to becoming and

these three

are what constitute that mental

proliferation

mental proliferation comes from the word

papancha

prapancha prapancha in excuse me in

sanskrit

and prapancha is also known as like a

vortex

you're getting caught up in this vortex

of thoughts

getting caught up in the hurricane or

tornado of thoughts

your your goal here your objective here

is not to get caught up

in the whirlwind

but to be in the eye of the storm

to be in the eye of the storm you become

very still

everything else around you moves

but your mind doesn't go here there or

whatever it's doing it just stays

here

so when you don't have these underlying

tendencies

then it says that is the end

of resorting to rods and weapons of

quarrels brawls disputes recrimination

malicious words and false speech

here these are evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder why is this

because when you have that sense of self

that self image that's always there when

the conceit is there you still have

something to prove

you still have something to defend

you still have something to say oh this

is wrong

or this is right according to my sense

of self

and so when you have to defend your view

when you have to defend your sense of

self

there arises

you know quarrels arguments

and from that sense of self they can

arise even violence

right taking up of the stick and sword

as he puts it or with that sense of self

you have something to prove or you have

something to gain from that sense of

self and sometimes you'll use deceit to

get that and so you use false speech

so this sense of self the self image

that you have

try to figure out what that is

write down in your you know in your

journal at some point and think

what is myself

who is this that i am

that i think i am

and write it all down

and realize that in that in those

moments you are not that it just arises

and passes away

the idea of who you think you are

is just a little fragment it's just a

little frame

an ever moving series of frames

but as soon as you hold on to that as

soon as you make that concrete

as soon as you freeze that frame that's

where the trouble begins

[Music]

that's where you defend some sense of

self

that's where you identify with some

sense of self

that is what the blessed one said having

said this the sublime one rose from his

seat and went into his dwelling

then soon after the blessed one had gone

the bhikkhus considered

now friends the blessed one has risen

from his seat and gone into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief

without expanding the detail meaning

now who will expound this in detail

he should have asked some questions

before he left

then they considered

the venerable maha kachana

is praised by the teacher and esteemed

by his wise companions in the holy life

he is capable of expounding the detailed

meaning

suppose we went to him

and asked him the meaning of this now

maha kachana was a great

uh

well he was an arahat for one and he was

a great expounder of a lot of things

that were said in brief

so there's a series of sutas in the

majaminikaya where mahakachana

gives

a very

detailed meaning of things that are said

in brief

and so he's known as the great expounder

you know the great elaborator the one

who breaks things down

and he's also somebody who

always talked about things in relation

to consciousness

so we'll talk about what he's we'll see

what he does in this particular suta

then the bhikkhus went to the venerable

mahakachana and exchanged greetings with

him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished they sat down to one side and

told him what had taken place adding

let the venerable mahaka-chana expound

it to us

so what do you think mahaka-chan is

going to say here

he says

friends

it is as though a man needing heartwood

seeking heartwood

wandering in search of heartwood

thought that heartwood should be sought

for

for among the branches and leaves of a

great tree standing possessed of

heartwood

after he had passed over the root and

the trunk

so in other words you're looking for the

core right you're looking for the core

of this tree but you're looking at it in

the branches in the trunk

and so it is with you venerable sirs

that you think that i should be asked

about the meaning of this

after you passed the blessed one by when

you were face to face with the teacher

in other words

why didn't you ask him questions

you had your chance

he was there

you should have asked him questions

nevertheless this is what mahakasha says

for knowing the blessed one knows seeing

he sees

he is vision he is knowledge he is the

he is the holy one he is the sayer the

proclaimer the elucidator of meaning the

giver of the deathless the lord of the

dama the

that was the time when you should have

asked the blessed one the meeting

as he told you so you should have

remembered it

[Music]

so this is what

the bhikkhu said

surely friend kachana knowing the

blessed one knows seeing he sees he is

vision the tata and so on that was the

time when we should have asked the

blessed one the meaning

as he told us so we should have

remembered it

yet the venerable mahaka chana is

praised by the teacher and esteemed by

his wise companions in the holy life

the venerable mahaka-chana is capable of

expounding the detailed meaning of the

summary given in brief

by the blessed one without expounding

the detailed meaning

let the venerable maha kachana expound

it without finding it troublesome

so in other words please

give us the answer here expound it for

us

you know

so mahakachana relents and he says all

right i'll do it he says then listen

friends and attend closely to what i

shall say

yes friend the bikus replied

the venerable maha kachana said this

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is because as to the source through

which perceptions and notions born of

mental proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight and

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendencies this is the end of resorting

to rods and weapons here these evil

unwholesome states cease without

remainder

i understand the detail meaning of it to

be as follows

now listen carefully

dependent on the i and forms i

consciousness arises

the meaning of the three is contact

what with contact as condition there is

feeling

what one feels that one perceives

what one perceives that one thinks about

what one thinks about that one mentally

proliferates

with what one mentally proliferated as

the source

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation beset a

person

with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the eye

let's break this down

dependent upon the eye and forms

so there is the eye

and there are colors and shapes and

patterns and forms

the light

bounces off these patterns these shapes

these forms

and then that light those photons

hit the retina in the eye

so dependent upon the eye and those

forms

there is i consciousness

what is i consciousness that is to say

the i consciousness

eye consciousness is the awareness of

the eye awareness of the experience of

the eye

the cognizing

of the experience

when you have these three

there is contact

for someone who is blind

there is no eye consciousness

they are not cognizing the eye they are

not able to be aware of the experience

of the eyes

so if there is no eye consciousness

and there is light there is form there

are shapes there's colors there's

patterns

and the light bounces off that uh

bounces off them and hits the retina

makes contact with the retina but

there's no consciousness there right

because for a blind person it's not

there

then there won't be contact

contact needs these three

it needs the sense base

it needs the object of that sun space

and it needs the consciousness of that

particular sense space these three

constitute

contact

what does contact mean

contact comes from the pali word

fasa or in sanskrit that is spursha

spurshad literally means to touch

so when they touch

there is the meeting right there is the

meeting of i and forms

and dependent upon that experience

depending upon that initial spark of

contact

there is feeling

so what is that feeling

that is seeing

the vision

of what it is that you are feeling

what one feels that one perceives

with feeling there is perception

what is perception

perception

is rooted in memory

when you were in school

when you were in kindergarten in the

first grade you learned about patterns

you learn about shapes you learned about

colors you learned about the seasons you

learned about how to tell time you

learned about the months you learned

about the days of the week you learned

about the alphabet you learn how to

write you learn how to spell

right you cognized you experienced all

of these things you were learning all of

these things

and then they became part of your memory

so now when you see

the color red your mind immediately

sees that is the color red the color

itself

makes contact with the eye

there is the eye consciousness

which then gives rise to the contact

and then you see

that color

the knowing of what that color is that

is to say that that is red is perception

it is the labeling it is the it's the

knowing

it's the

mind that says i know what this is it's

the mind that recognizes

that

recognizes what it initially cognized

what it initially learned

when you put your hand on the stove

right the first time you put it you're

curious and say what is this immediately

you feel heat

and now you know what heat feels like

you stay a little longer and it hurts

and yeah you recognize that as a painful

feeling

so next time you're at the stove fire

you will be careful

because you see the stove fire and you

perceive it to be hot and potentially

painful

that perception is the knowing the

recognition

that that fire is hot and that fire can

be painful

so it's rooted in memory

what one perceives that one thinks about

now this is very important to understand

what does that mean what one thinks

about

when one has a relationship with it in

terms of a sense of self

that is the taking it personally

that is

seeing it or experiencing it

and comparing it from a sense of self

that self image

how does this affect that me

how does it benefit me

is it mine

is it me

is it myself

that is the thinking about it

that's the underlying tendency

and so what one thinks about that one

mentally proliferates that there is

craving there there is aversion there

there is clinging

there's clinging to views clinging to

that experience clinging to a self-view

right

or clinging to rights and rituals in

regards to that experience and then

there is a becoming you identify with

that further and then create the sense

of self from which you react

this whole process happens like that

but that is the process that is mental

proliferation

in meditation that process seems to slow

down because you become more mindful

you become more aware you become more

collected

what is that collectedness

if there is a bowl of water a clear bowl

of water and there is dirt in there

and it's agitated

there's all these ideas and thoughts

there's all of this mental proliferation

going on

then there's no way for you to be able

to see that mental proliferation you are

in it

the mind is

in it

but the moment you settle down

you sit down for meditation

you clear your mind

you 6r

you let go

and you collect your mind around

something

the dirt in that water settles down

and now you see the clarity of that

so you need that process of settling

down the mind through meditation

through samadhi

and that is preceded and dependent upon

having right mindfulness

being able to recognize your mind being

collected or not collected

and that is predicated upon

right effort

using the six hour process

and that is predicated upon

keeping your precepts

why

because when you do not keep your

precepts when you do break the precepts

there's agitation that arises in the

mind and

it shakes up that water

and you're not able to clearly see but

as you continue to commit to keeping the

precepts

as you commit to keeping

you know all of the

you have the commitment to keep your

precepts but you also have the

commitment

to incline the mind towards nibana

that's the chanda the wholesome desire

then that gives rise to naturally the

right effort naturally right mindfulness

naturally collectedness then that gives

naturally

that gives rise to naturally right

knowledge right wisdom

right insight

and right liberation

so with what one has mentally

proliferated as the source meaning

whatever you've thought about you've

clung to you've craved for you've clung

to you've become that

the perceptions and notions born from

that

beset a person with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the year

so in other words you relate to the

sense of self in relation to the past

in relation to the present in relation

to the future how does that happen

you say this is how it was in the past

and you compare it to what it is now or

when you are staying in the present

moment with the sense of self you say

this is who i am or this is mine or this

is me

and when you think about into the future

that can give rise to anxiety

how will it affect me

will it be good for me will it be bad

for me

how should i plan this how should i do

that

all of these kinds of mental

proliferation arise

so

he says the same for this

dependent amount upon the year and the

sounds dependent on the nose and odors

dependent on the tongue and flavors

dependent on the body and tangibles

dependent on the mind and mind objects

so now he's saying in reference to

everything we just talked about

with regards to the ear and sounds

the same process happens

with regards to the nose and odors the

same process happens with regard to

taste in the tongue the same process can

happen with regard to the body and

tangibles

temperature and pressure and so on the

same thing can happen

and with regard to mind objects what

what could be mind objects

what did we talk about yesterday what

kind of mind objects can arise

hindrances can arise

enlightenment factors can arise the four

noble truths the understanding of the

four noble truths can arise

loving kindness can arise equanimity can

arise

thoughts in general can rise

so mind objects right dependent on the

mind and mind objects mind consciousness

arises

the meeting of the three is contact

let's simplify that understanding and

say there is the mind

and there is the mind object which is a

loving-kindness

and dependent upon those there is the

mental awareness of that

and now there is contact with the

loving-kindness

and then there is the feeling of

lovingkindness that arises

and there is the perception that what is

present is loving-kindness

what one perceives that one thinks about

that thinking about remember that's very

key here

what one thinks about what one thing's

about in relation to a sense of self

so when you meditate do you say this is

my loving kindness i am feeling loving

kindness

oh the loving kindness went away

something is wrong

or when you have the quiet mind

i am in quiet mind

my mind is quiet

this is my quiet mind

and so on

that's the thinking about there

and then thinking about there that

there is mental proliferation

that's where the trouble is

because as soon as you identify with any

of the objects you need to you want to

hold on to them you need to hold on to

them because the sense of self is

dependent upon them

and it feels like it needs to cling to

it it feels like it needs to survive its

survival depends upon it

so you feel terrible when it goes away

you have agitation when it goes away

but if you just see everything as an

impersonal process even the meditation

objects

even the process of meditation

then it's like just watching a movie

you don't get so engrossed in it you

realize oh i'm just watching all this

happening

this happens through that metacognition

you're just watching mind have an

experience

you're watching mind meditate

you are not meditating

you are not the meditation you are not

the meditator

there is just an obser observation of

mind

experiencing loving kindness

there is an observation of mind being

quiet

there is an observation of mind

being in the signless collectedness of

mind

there is an observation of mind being

equanimous

being joyful and so on

this is true

meditation true mindfulness

[Music]

so what one has mentally proliferation

proliferated as the source perceptions

with no perceptions and notions born

from their proliferation beset a person

with respect to past future and present

mind objects cognizable through the mind

this is what we just talked about

but now he says

he adds further to this he says when

there is the i

a form and i consciousness

it is possible to point out the

manifestation of contact

so you have the eye

you have the objects let's say that's me

and you have the awareness of the eye

right the light bounces off of me and

you're seeing me

and now there is the manifestation of

contact

but let's say you close your eyes

so now the eye is there

the form is there but there's no

awareness of the eye

and so there is no contact

if you close your eyes you can't see me

so there is no manifestation of contact

there

when there is the manifestation of

contact it is possible to point out the

manifestation of feeling

when there is the manifestation of

feeling it is possible to point out the

manifestation of perception

when there is the manifestation of

perception it is possible to point out

the manifestation of

thinking here it is possible to point

out the manifestation of thinking that

thinking again

the sense of self the the

the equating to that experience with a

sense of self is only possible when

there is an experience

the sense of self is dependent upon

having an experience

the experiencer

arises dependent upon the experience

the seer the hearer

the thinker

the cognizer

that arises dependent upon the sight

the sound

the thought

the object of cognition

so that's the only way that thinking can

arise

when there is the manifestation of

thinking it is possible to point out the

manifestation

of besetment by perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

so in other words it is possible to

point these out

in other words it is possible to

recognize when these happen

when there is contact you can recognize

that contact

when there is feeling you can recognize

that feeling

when there is craving

when there is a thinking about this in

relation to a self you can point that

out you can recognize that if you can

recognize it you can release it you can

relax it you can

re-smile you can return back to an

object that is wholesome

not identified

with a sense of self

so in other words you can recognize

contact you can recognize feeling you

can recognize perception you can

recognize craving an aversion you can

recognize clinging and you can recognize

becoming

and of course birth of action and the

whole mass of suffering

if you can recognize these things you

can let go of them up up to a point up

to the birth of action and i'll talk

about that when we talk about dependent

origination

yeah

um i have embarrassment

arising right now oh my butter feels

like it's about to burst yeah

can i use the restroom go ahead

would you say that again about the

thinker arising only

once the thought arises right so the

experience the sense of the self is

dependent upon the experience

when there is an experience when there

is a thought when there is a cognition

when there is a sight when there is a

sound when there is any of these there

is a sense of self that arises in

dependence

independence on it

on that experience

in other words the mind

is prone

to superimpose a sense of self to the

experience

it's not because there is an experiencer

that there is an experience

the experience is there

whether you know it or not but the

superimposition of a sense of self gives

rise to the idea

of an experiencer

now he says

when there is no i no form and no i

consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of contact that makes

sense

right if the i is not present but there

is forms and there won't be any

consciousness there can't be any contact

when there is no manifestation of

contact it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of feeling

when there is no manifestation of

feeling it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of perception when

there is no manifestation of perception

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of thinking

when there is no manifestation

of thinking

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetmint by

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

so there's a couple of ways to

understand this

one is the cessation of perception

feeling and consciousness

when there is the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

even though

the sense bases are present

even though the sense objects

the objects of those senses are present

there is no consciousness the link

between the two

to give rise to any kind of contact

and therefore there is no rise of

feeling or perception

so when you are in the cessation

or when there is rather the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

there can be no suffering

there can be no potential for suffering

that's the cessation of all conditions

there the mind is unconditioned

and then when the mind is unconditioned

the first initial spark of when the mind

comes back up

there is an experience of that

unconditioned for that moment that

contact

and then there is the experience there

is that feeling born from contact with

the unconditioned

now

when that feeling arises

if there is a thinking about that

experience

if there is a sense of self

tied to that experience of that joy and

that relief someone might experience the

mind experiences after having

experienced nibana

[Music]

then there is mental proliferation so

then that means some of the feathers are

still present

some have dropped and some are still

present

when there is no thinking about the

experience and there is just the

experience

then the feathers drop because there's

no conceit there

and depending upon that conceit the

restlessness goes away the craving for

existence goes away the ignorance goes

away

so he says the same thing he says when

there is no ear no sound and no your

consciousness

when there is no nose no order and no

nose consciousness when there is no

tongue no flavor and no tongue

consciousness when there is no body no

tangible and no body consciousness when

there is no mind no mind object and no

mind consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetting by

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is bhikkhu

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset one

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust of the underlying

tendency to aversion of the underlying

tendency to views of the underlying

tendency to doubt of the underlying

tendency to conceit of the underlying

tendency to desire for being of the

underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to rods and

weapons of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here

these evil unwholesome states cease

without remainder

so in other words the second

understanding of that is yes

in the fully awakened mind in the fully

realized mind there is still contact

so it is still possible

to point out the manifestation of

contact the manifestation of feeling the

manifestation of perception

but because that fully awakened mind no

longer has any conceit no longer has

that self image which it relates that

self to an experience

there is no more mental proliferation

nibana itself one of the synonyms for

nibana

is

nipa pancha

which means

no mental proliferation

that's the mind of the fully awakened

mind that's that's the experience of the

fully awakened mind

it does not relate to everything from a

sense of self

it doesn't have any mental proliferation

of anything so nibana is understood as

that initial experience of the

unconditioned

and also the mind of the araha

because there is

a mind without craving there

right there's no craving there's no

sense of self there's no conceit there's

no ignorance there's no views there's no

doubt there's no

relating to it with a sense of self so

there can be no more suffering

i understand the detailed meaning of

this summary to be thus now friends if

you wish go to the blessed one and ask

him about the meaning of this as the

blessed one explains it to you

so you should remember it

then the bhikkhus having delighted and

rejoiced in the venerable maha kachana's

words rose from their seats and went to

the blessed one

after paying homage to him they sat down

at one side and told the blessed one all

that had taken place after he had left

adding

then the venerable sir then venerable

sir

we went to the venerable mahakachana and

asked him about the meaning the

venerable mahaka-chana expounded the

meaning to us with these terms

statements and phrases

and so the

buddha says mahaka-chana is wise because

mahaka chana has great wisdom

if you had asked me the meaning of this

i would have explained it to you

in the same way that mahaka chana has

explained it

such is the meaning of this and so you

should remember it

when he says that someone is wise or has

great wisdom

what he's saying is that someone has had

a full understanding

of dependent origination

they have fully realized for themselves

how dependent origination works

and it doesn't mean that they have

analyzed it it means they have

experienced it

when they have seen it it means they

have actually

understood it through

experience of how the links of dependent

origination arise and pass away

and so from that experience they become

wise

and they have why a great wisdom

when this was said the venerable ananda

went to the blessed one

and said to him venerable sir just as if

a man exhausted by hunger and weakness

came upon a honey ball

wherever he would taste it he would find

a sweet delectable flavor honey ball

what is a honey ball it was some kind of

a dessert back then

you know it

the equivalent of that would be today

gulab jamun in indian desserts you know

i don't know if you've ever had gulab

jamun but it tastes pretty good

so too venerable sir any able-minded

bhikkhu

wherever he might

scrutinize with wisdom the meaning of

this discourse on the dhamma would find

satisfaction and confidence of mind

venerable sir what is the name of this

discourse on the dhamma

as to that ananda you may remember this

discourse on the dhamma as the honeyball

discourse

that is what the blessed one said the

venerable ananda was satisfied and

delighted in the blessed one's words

any questions

it seemed that

there were

the five aggregates except instead of

formations he was using the word dots

so the five aggregates there yeah we

have um feeling perception

and intention so the intention there are

the formations

and consciousness

so body obviously is there and so on but

the the five aggregates are actually at

the level of mentality materiality

nama rupa which are the faculties

through which the process of contact can

happen

the process of feeling can happen the

process of perception can happen

the process of intention can happen so

if the intention

the intention here is not just like i

want to do this but just the thought the

idea is rooted in the sense of self

rooted in the idea that this is me this

is mine this is myself that is the

thinking about that we're talking about

and the attention is the cognizing of

that experience that is the

consciousness related to

the eye the ear the nose and so on

yes that's right

so the the the

the stopping of the flow of mental

proliferation is facilitated by using

right effort which are the six r's

which is recognizing that there is

proliferation recognizing there is an

identification with this experience

releasing your attention from it

relaxing and then re-smiling and

returning

but there was a lot there said yeah i

feel like what i said was very short

[Laughter]

well what he's doing is he's breaking it

down into different steps

and these steps happen very quickly

so the steps that he was breaking it

down into was the contact

right so you the the initial spark of

the eye and the form

the feeling the actual experience of

seeing whatever it is that you're seeing

and then the perception which is the

cogniti recognizing a recognition of

what it is that you're seeing like if

i'm seeing the color red

i'm recognizing that that's red

and then i think about it and i say

oh i i like red red is my favorite color

or i don't like red and then that that

whole idea of identifying with that

experience is the thinking about

yes because one is that you realize that

this is all impersonal in the first case

when you become a solar panel when

somebody attains

stream entry they have let go of the

idea of

or the view the intellectual view of a

personal self

they realize oh this is all impersonal

it's happening because of a series of

processes they see it for themselves

and then

they start to recognize these different

components these different links

as a result of that so in their

day-to-day life they realize oh here's

the feeling here's the experience right

now it just happens automatically they

don't have to think about it they

realize oh

here's the perception oh here's the

craving and as soon as you recognize the

craving you can start letting it go and

as you get through each of the

attainments it becomes clearer and

clearer and clearer and so as it becomes

clearer and clearer and clearer there is

reduced craving until there is no more

craving until there is no more ignorance

and there is no more suffering

so it's a reduction of suffering through

these attainments

all right

let's share some merit

my suffering ones be suffering free may

the fear struck fearless be may the

grieving shed all grief and may all

beings find relief

may all beings share this merit that we

have thus acquired for the acquisition

of all kinds of happiness may beings

inhabiting space and earth devas and

nagas of mighty power share this merit

of ours may they long protect the

buddha's dispensation

you

me

[Music]

so today we are going to be reading from

majamanikaya 18

madhu pindika suta the honey ball

thus have i heard on one occasion the

blessed one was living in the sakyan

country at kapalavatu in negrodus park

kapalavatu was

the buddha's

birthplace or place where he grew up

and

that is now located in modern day nepal

then when it was morning the blessed one

dressed and taking his bowl and outer

robe went into kapalavatu for alms

when he had wandered for arms in

kapalavatu and had returned from his

arms round

after his meal he went to the great wood

for the days abiding

and entering the great wood sat down at

the root of a bilva

sapling for the days abiding

the day's abiding that is what you guys

are doing all day long meditating

so that could be four hours that could

be six hours that could be eight hours

it could be twelve hours

while walking and wandering for exercise

also went to the great wood

and when he had entered the great wood

he went to the bilva sapling where the

blessed one was and exchange great

greetings with him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished

he stood at one side leaning on his stok

stick

and asked the blessed one

what does the recluse assert what does

he proclaim

dandapani

he was this

well

he was the buddha's father-in-law

and he had a

chip on his shoulder because obviously

the buddha when he was the bodhisattva

left you know in the middle of the night

his wife who was stunned upon his

daughter

and the one the reason why he's called

dandapani is because he had this great

golden stick

danda means stick

and he would walk around with that stick

and

later on when the buddha's cousin

devadat

devadatta

created the schism

dandapani decided to side

with devadatta

so

he always didn't like the buddha for

for many different reasons

so when he says what does the recluse

assert what does he proclaim

really what he's saying is what are you

about you know he's he's being rude to

the buddha obnoxious to the buddha

what are you talking about you know that

kind of attitude what do you know

so the buddha says

friend

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way

that one does not quarrel with anyone in

the world with its gods

its maras and its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas

its princes and its people

in such a way that perceptions no more

underlie that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity

shorn of worry

free from craving

for any kind of being

so let's separate that statement a

little bit because this whole suta is

actually an elaboration of that

statement but i'll give you a little

brief understanding of what he's saying

here

first and foremost he says

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way that one does not quarrel

with anyone in this world

it's a direct answer to dhandapani who

is looking to argue with the buddha

who's looking to debate with the buddha

who's looking to

quarrel with the buddha

and the buddha says that my teaching is

such that i don't quarrel with anyone

my teaching is not for debating

my teaching the dhamma

is not for having arguments about what

is right and what is wrong

what is the dhamma and what is not the

dhamma

so he teaches in such a way

that perceptions no more underlie that

brahman

when he says brahman he's not talking

about the brahmanas in terms of the

priest class

of ancient india

he's talking about the brahman from what

it means really the word brahman what it

means to be realized to be awakened so

the awakened one the buddha he's

referring to himself

or in arahat

the brahmana

so the perceptions the sensual

perceptions or let's say this

perceptions in general no more underlie

that person who abides detached from

sensual pleasures

he no longer has sensual craving

without perplexity

he no longer has doubt the fetter of

doubt

shorn of worry he no longer has any kind

of restlessness

and free from craving for any kind of

being

so this is just a summation a summary

of having destroyed all ten fetters

let go of any kind of doubt

let go of any sensual craving and in

turn any kind of aversion

let go of restlessness let go of conceit

let go of all views

and let go of any craving for existence

or non-existence

when this was said dandapani the sakyan

what do you think dhandarpani would have

done when he heard this

he shook his head

wagged his tongue

and raised his eyebrows until his

forehead was puckered in three lines

then he departed leaning on his stick so

obviously he wasn't happy with that

answer

then when it was evening the blessed one

rose from meditation and went to

negrodus park

where he sat down on a seat made ready

for him

and told the bakus what had taken place

then a certain bhikkhu asked the blessed

one

but venerable sir how does the blessed

one assert and proclaim his teaching in

such a way

that he does not quarrel with anyone in

this world with its gods its maras and

its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas its princes and its people

and venerable sir

how is it that perceptions no more

underlie the blessed one that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity shorn of worry

free from craving for any kind of being

now listen to what he says

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust

of the underlying tendency to aversion

of the underlying tendency to views

of the underlying tendency to doubt

of the underlying tendency to conceit

of the underlying tendency to desire for

being

of the underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to

rods and weapons

of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here these evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder

so he says

[Music]

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

beset a person

so

how does mental proliferation arise

first of all what is mental

proliferation

mental proliferation is that example

that venerable metananda gave us

yesterday where he was thinking about

something and then it led to another

thought and then it led to another

thought and then led to another thought

and now you're all over the place you're

clinging to this side here you're

clinging to that idea

and you want to do this you want to do

that and then there's bhava and then

that could lead to some kind of birth of

action

so mental proliferation is three part

it's the initial craving that arises

right so that craving that we talk about

the link of craving

that arises dependent upon feeling

so that craving can be

sensual craving you hear something and

that triggers a memory

and then you cling to that memory so

that's the clinging and you think about

that memory and you say oh yeah i was

this in that memory or i wonder what

would happen if we did it differently

you know all of these thoughts that

arise so that's the bhava that's the

becoming

or it could be craving for existence or

craving for non-existence now any of

these types of craving are dependent

upon feeling

now in that feeling we have threefold

right there's three kinds of feeling

there's pleasant feeling

there's painful feeling and there's

neither painful nor pleasant feeling

these are the three tones of any kind of

experience

so

when there is a pleasant feeling

right you see something beautiful

you hear something wonderful

you taste something delicious

you smell something fragrant

you have a very comfortable sitting

posture it's all very pleasant

if you identify with that experience

if you take that experience personally

that pleasant experience

what can arise as a result

in that is the underlying tendency

to craving

this is the bridge these underlying

tendencies that we talked about now he

just talked about the seven underlying

tendencies

these underlie an experience

pleasant painful or neutral

so if it's pleasant it can give rise

if you identify with it

if you say this is me

this is mine this is myself the

underlying tendency to craving that's

that branch

that goes into full-blown link of

craving

that is where the the mental

proliferation begins

if it's a painful feeling

and you say i don't like it the initial

reaction in the mind is

oh i don't like this this is

uncomfortable

and then there's this taking it

personally the taking of it personally

what does that mean the taking of it

personally

how do you identify with something how

do you identify with a sensation

how do you identify with an experience

how does that happen

there's a sense of self-image that you

have

you create this idea that this is who i

am

you create this story in your mind of

this is me

these are my experiences these are my

memories

and you consolidate them into some kind

of sense of self

and this is always there this is the

underlying tendency to conceit

it's always there for somebody who is

not fully realized

and that underlying tendency to conceit

that's what says

that's what compares and contrasts all

the experiences

and the litmus test

right the the touchstone

is that sense of self that image that

you have about yourself

and then every experience is said to be

oh how does this affect that me

how does it affect the sense of me

and so if it says it's pleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

craving if it says it's unpleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

aversion

if it says

it's neutral i don't care about it there

can be the underlying tendency to

ignorance

now whether it's ignorance

or towards views

or doubt or conceit or the desire for

being

these can underlie

pleasant feeling painful feeling

or even neutral feeling

how how does the underlying tendency to

ignorance come about

the very fact that you take this thing

personally this experience personally

whether the experience is a sensory

experience

whether this experience is a meditative

experience whether this experience is

you know some imagination in your mind

whatever it might be

when you have that sense of self that

intrinsic sense of self of taking it

personally

that is where the conceit the underlying

tendency to conceit is

dependent upon that depending upon what

kind of feeling it is there can be the

underlying tendency to ignorance

what is ignorance

ignorance is

not being aware of the four noble truths

forgetting to six are

because

what are the four noble truths that

there is suffering

that there is a source or origin of this

suffering

that there is a cessation of that

suffering

and that there is a way leading to the

cessation of that suffering

now you have a pleasant feeling

or you have a hindrance that arises

you take that hindrance personally and

you say you judge yourself and you say

why am i feeling

this sensual craving or i don't like

that i'm feeling this way

or i don't like this particular

hindrance

and now you have mental proliferation

you have self-doubt which creates more

self-doubt

you have restlessness which creates more

restlessness every time you take it

personally

but if you recognize

the hindrance

that is recognizing the first noble

truth of suffering this hindrance is the

suffering

and then you release your attention from

that the undue attention to that

hindrance in the form of clinging to it

in the form of wanting to push it away

in the form of taking it personally

staying there the undo attention feeds

that hindrance further

so that is a type of craving that

reactivity to that you release that

you relax

when you relax

your mind becomes

free of any kind of craving

so it experiences

the third noble truth

of the cessation of craving which is the

cessation of suffering

then you come back to the smile and then

you come back to the object

this coming back to the smile coming

back to the object is the fourth noble

truth

the cultivation of the way leading

to the cessation of suffering

that is the eightfold path

because the six hours

is right effort

and right effort

is the core of the eightfold path

it is through right effort that you go

from the wrong view to right view

the wrong intention to right intention

the wrong speech to right speech

the wrong action to right action

the wrong livelihood to right livelihood

the wrong mindfulness to right

mindfulness

the wrong collectedness to right

collectiveness so using the six r's

at the experience whatever that

experience is

if you notice that the mind is clinging

to that experience if you notice that

the mind is becoming

engrossed in that experience identifying

with that experience

you recognize that

release your attention from that

relax

re-smile and return back

to that wholesome mindset

what about the underlying tendency to

doubts the underlying tendency to doubt

is about doubt in reference to what is

wholesome and what is unwholesome

what is the right path and what is the

wrong path

so

if there is an experience you might have

confusion about what to do with that

that's the perplexity am i meditating

am i in the first jhana

or am i in the seventh genre

am i experience equanimity

do i have a hindrance

i wonder if i'm doing this correctly

do i remember the instructions that were

given

all of these kinds of thoughts

this is the kind of underlying tendency

to doubt

right so there's an experience that you

have in meditation and you think wait is

this the right thing that i should be is

this the loving kindness that they were

talking about is this the equanimity

that i'm supposed to experience

all of these are the this is the

hindrance of doubt

right so let go of that let the

meditation flow stop trying to analyze

what's going on

stop trying to unnecessarily investigate

what's going on

the true understanding of investigation

of states is the understanding of what

is present and what is not present

what is present and what is not present

meaning you understand okay there is

present right now doubt

or there is present right now craving or

there is present right now

loving-kindness that's it

if there is doubt if there is craving if

there is restlessness

you six are

and come back to your object of

meditation what about views underlying

tendency to views

these views are about

you know

self-use

i am this or i am that

or this is me or this is mine

right this is related to conceit but

this is also related to self-view and

other kinds of wrong views

you know you kind of you try to justify

why is this there

you try to justify or analyze why is it

present why is it not present

right and then there's also underlying

tendencies to view in terms of if

something pleasant happen you'll say

oh i just got lucky

you know or you'll you'll identify with

it and say

oh i i don't know how this happened you

know there are these different kinds of

views that arise in reference to

feeling in reference to perception in

reference to the world and in reference

to self we'll talk about that when we

talk about clinging to views

right so it's a clinging to wrong kinds

of view

wrong kinds of view with the idea that

this was faded to happen that's a kind

of wrong view or the wrong view that i

have to do something about this by

purifying my karma

that's a ascetic kind of view

or there's nothing wrong with what i'm

doing even though you know it to be

wrong

there's that little nudge in your mind

that says this is probably not what you

should be doing and you'll say oh it's

no big deal nobody has to know

that's a different kind of wrong view

because you think oh nothing really

matters there's no

there's no karma here there's no cause

and consequence here that's a different

kind of wrong view

so these are the different kinds of

underlying tendency to views

what about the underlying tendency

to

the desire for being

the underlying tendency

to desire for being

that's

that means the desire to exist in a

certain kind of way

you have a pleasant feeling and you say

i hope this feeling doesn't stop

you experience loving kindness and you

say

i hope i can stay with this loving

kindness

as soon as a loving kindness fades away

you say what

happened you know i you try to hold on

to that

in this meditation you don't hold on to

anything

the objective is not to hold on to

anything

the object of meditation is a

is a

is a means for your mind to be stable

it's a means for your mind to be

collected to be centered

so which means that you're just using it

to let your mind be collected

the unification of mind

anything beyond that where you try to

hold on to the object

is a underlying tendency to desire for

being

[Music]

so joy comes up and you say oh the joy

dissipated i must be doing something

wrong

right so let go of any attachment to how

things should be

or how things should not be that's

another kind of desire for being

right it's like

i don't want to be in this particular

retreat or i don't want to be doing this

or i don't want to be doing that i don't

want to be

that's the beginning of desire for

non-existence

so let go of attachment to any kind of

experience

in this retreat make it a point to just

allow experiences to flow

without identifying with them

be like that

you know that audience who's just

watching a movie just playing out

a movie

don't get caught up in what's going on

in the movie

the movie may be interesting maybe

pleasant maybe unpleasant

you know it might be a romance it might

be a drama it might be a comedy it might

be a horror

whatever kind of film it is

just watch it

don't get engrossed in it

right it's just a movie just watch

everything as it is

without identifying with it without

supplanting that sense of this is me

this is mine this is myself

to that experience

whether it's right now

or whether it's when you're meditating

just let everything

flow as soon as you try to hold on to it

there the craving arises that's the

underlying tendency that gives rise to

the full-blown craving and that craving

then gives rise to clinging and that

clinging gives rise to becoming and

these three

are what constitute that mental

proliferation

mental proliferation comes from the word

papancha

prapancha prapancha in excuse me in

sanskrit

and prapancha is also known as like a

vortex

you're getting caught up in this vortex

of thoughts

getting caught up in the hurricane or

tornado of thoughts

your your goal here your objective here

is not to get caught up

in the whirlwind

but to be in the eye of the storm

to be in the eye of the storm you become

very still

everything else around you moves

but your mind doesn't go here there or

whatever it's doing it just stays

here

so when you don't have these underlying

tendencies

then it says that is the end

of resorting to rods and weapons of

quarrels brawls disputes recrimination

malicious words and false speech

here these are evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder why is this

because when you have that sense of self

that self image that's always there when

the conceit is there you still have

something to prove

you still have something to defend

you still have something to say oh this

is wrong

or this is right according to my sense

of self

and so when you have to defend your view

when you have to defend your sense of

self

there arises

you know quarrels arguments

and from that sense of self they can

arise even violence

right taking up of the stick and sword

as he puts it or with that sense of self

you have something to prove or you have

something to gain from that sense of

self and sometimes you'll use deceit to

get that and so you use false speech

so this sense of self the self image

that you have

try to figure out what that is

write down in your you know in your

journal at some point and think

what is myself

who is this that i am

that i think i am

and write it all down

and realize that in that in those

moments you are not that it just arises

and passes away

the idea of who you think you are

is just a little fragment it's just a

little frame

an ever moving series of frames

but as soon as you hold on to that as

soon as you make that concrete

as soon as you freeze that frame that's

where the trouble begins

[Music]

that's where you defend some sense of

self

that's where you identify with some

sense of self

that is what the blessed one said having

said this the sublime one rose from his

seat and went into his dwelling

then soon after the blessed one had gone

the bhikkhus considered

now friends the blessed one has risen

from his seat and gone into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief

without expanding the detail meaning

now who will expound this in detail

he should have asked some questions

before he left

then they considered

the venerable maha kachana

is praised by the teacher and esteemed

by his wise companions in the holy life

he is capable of expounding the detailed

meaning

suppose we went to him

and asked him the meaning of this now

maha kachana was a great

uh

well he was an arahat for one and he was

a great expounder of a lot of things

that were said in brief

so there's a series of sutas in the

majaminikaya where mahakachana

gives

a very

detailed meaning of things that are said

in brief

and so he's known as the great expounder

you know the great elaborator the one

who breaks things down

and he's also somebody who

always talked about things in relation

to consciousness

so we'll talk about what he's we'll see

what he does in this particular suta

then the bhikkhus went to the venerable

mahakachana and exchanged greetings with

him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished they sat down to one side and

told him what had taken place adding

let the venerable mahaka-chana expound

it to us

so what do you think mahaka-chan is

going to say here

he says

friends

it is as though a man needing heartwood

seeking heartwood

wandering in search of heartwood

thought that heartwood should be sought

for

for among the branches and leaves of a

great tree standing possessed of

heartwood

after he had passed over the root and

the trunk

so in other words you're looking for the

core right you're looking for the core

of this tree but you're looking at it in

the branches in the trunk

and so it is with you venerable sirs

that you think that i should be asked

about the meaning of this

after you passed the blessed one by when

you were face to face with the teacher

in other words

why didn't you ask him questions

you had your chance

he was there

you should have asked him questions

nevertheless this is what mahakasha says

for knowing the blessed one knows seeing

he sees

he is vision he is knowledge he is the

he is the holy one he is the sayer the

proclaimer the elucidator of meaning the

giver of the deathless the lord of the

dama the

that was the time when you should have

asked the blessed one the meeting

as he told you so you should have

remembered it

[Music]

so this is what

the bhikkhu said

surely friend kachana knowing the

blessed one knows seeing he sees he is

vision the tata and so on that was the

time when we should have asked the

blessed one the meaning

as he told us so we should have

remembered it

yet the venerable mahaka chana is

praised by the teacher and esteemed by

his wise companions in the holy life

the venerable mahaka-chana is capable of

expounding the detailed meaning of the

summary given in brief

by the blessed one without expounding

the detailed meaning

let the venerable maha kachana expound

it without finding it troublesome

so in other words please

give us the answer here expound it for

us

you know

so mahakachana relents and he says all

right i'll do it he says then listen

friends and attend closely to what i

shall say

yes friend the bikus replied

the venerable maha kachana said this

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is because as to the source through

which perceptions and notions born of

mental proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight and

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendencies this is the end of resorting

to rods and weapons here these evil

unwholesome states cease without

remainder

i understand the detail meaning of it to

be as follows

now listen carefully

dependent on the i and forms i

consciousness arises

the meaning of the three is contact

what with contact as condition there is

feeling

what one feels that one perceives

what one perceives that one thinks about

what one thinks about that one mentally

proliferates

with what one mentally proliferated as

the source

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation beset a

person

with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the eye

let's break this down

dependent upon the eye and forms

so there is the eye

and there are colors and shapes and

patterns and forms

the light

bounces off these patterns these shapes

these forms

and then that light those photons

hit the retina in the eye

so dependent upon the eye and those

forms

there is i consciousness

what is i consciousness that is to say

the i consciousness

eye consciousness is the awareness of

the eye awareness of the experience of

the eye

the cognizing

of the experience

when you have these three

there is contact

for someone who is blind

there is no eye consciousness

they are not cognizing the eye they are

not able to be aware of the experience

of the eyes

so if there is no eye consciousness

and there is light there is form there

are shapes there's colors there's

patterns

and the light bounces off that uh

bounces off them and hits the retina

makes contact with the retina but

there's no consciousness there right

because for a blind person it's not

there

then there won't be contact

contact needs these three

it needs the sense base

it needs the object of that sun space

and it needs the consciousness of that

particular sense space these three

constitute

contact

what does contact mean

contact comes from the pali word

fasa or in sanskrit that is spursha

spurshad literally means to touch

so when they touch

there is the meeting right there is the

meeting of i and forms

and dependent upon that experience

depending upon that initial spark of

contact

there is feeling

so what is that feeling

that is seeing

the vision

of what it is that you are feeling

what one feels that one perceives

with feeling there is perception

what is perception

perception

is rooted in memory

when you were in school

when you were in kindergarten in the

first grade you learned about patterns

you learn about shapes you learned about

colors you learned about the seasons you

learned about how to tell time you

learned about the months you learned

about the days of the week you learned

about the alphabet you learn how to

write you learn how to spell

right you cognized you experienced all

of these things you were learning all of

these things

and then they became part of your memory

so now when you see

the color red your mind immediately

sees that is the color red the color

itself

makes contact with the eye

there is the eye consciousness

which then gives rise to the contact

and then you see

that color

the knowing of what that color is that

is to say that that is red is perception

it is the labeling it is the it's the

knowing

it's the

mind that says i know what this is it's

the mind that recognizes

that

recognizes what it initially cognized

what it initially learned

when you put your hand on the stove

right the first time you put it you're

curious and say what is this immediately

you feel heat

and now you know what heat feels like

you stay a little longer and it hurts

and yeah you recognize that as a painful

feeling

so next time you're at the stove fire

you will be careful

because you see the stove fire and you

perceive it to be hot and potentially

painful

that perception is the knowing the

recognition

that that fire is hot and that fire can

be painful

so it's rooted in memory

what one perceives that one thinks about

now this is very important to understand

what does that mean what one thinks

about

when one has a relationship with it in

terms of a sense of self

that is the taking it personally

that is

seeing it or experiencing it

and comparing it from a sense of self

that self image

how does this affect that me

how does it benefit me

is it mine

is it me

is it myself

that is the thinking about it

that's the underlying tendency

and so what one thinks about that one

mentally proliferates that there is

craving there there is aversion there

there is clinging

there's clinging to views clinging to

that experience clinging to a self-view

right

or clinging to rights and rituals in

regards to that experience and then

there is a becoming you identify with

that further and then create the sense

of self from which you react

this whole process happens like that

but that is the process that is mental

proliferation

in meditation that process seems to slow

down because you become more mindful

you become more aware you become more

collected

what is that collectedness

if there is a bowl of water a clear bowl

of water and there is dirt in there

and it's agitated

there's all these ideas and thoughts

there's all of this mental proliferation

going on

then there's no way for you to be able

to see that mental proliferation you are

in it

the mind is

in it

but the moment you settle down

you sit down for meditation

you clear your mind

you 6r

you let go

and you collect your mind around

something

the dirt in that water settles down

and now you see the clarity of that

so you need that process of settling

down the mind through meditation

through samadhi

and that is preceded and dependent upon

having right mindfulness

being able to recognize your mind being

collected or not collected

and that is predicated upon

right effort

using the six hour process

and that is predicated upon

keeping your precepts

why

because when you do not keep your

precepts when you do break the precepts

there's agitation that arises in the

mind and

it shakes up that water

and you're not able to clearly see but

as you continue to commit to keeping the

precepts

as you commit to keeping

you know all of the

you have the commitment to keep your

precepts but you also have the

commitment

to incline the mind towards nibana

that's the chanda the wholesome desire

then that gives rise to naturally the

right effort naturally right mindfulness

naturally collectedness then that gives

naturally

that gives rise to naturally right

knowledge right wisdom

right insight

and right liberation

so with what one has mentally

proliferated as the source meaning

whatever you've thought about you've

clung to you've craved for you've clung

to you've become that

the perceptions and notions born from

that

beset a person with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the year

so in other words you relate to the

sense of self in relation to the past

in relation to the present in relation

to the future how does that happen

you say this is how it was in the past

and you compare it to what it is now or

when you are staying in the present

moment with the sense of self you say

this is who i am or this is mine or this

is me

and when you think about into the future

that can give rise to anxiety

how will it affect me

will it be good for me will it be bad

for me

how should i plan this how should i do

that

all of these kinds of mental

proliferation arise

so

he says the same for this

dependent amount upon the year and the

sounds dependent on the nose and odors

dependent on the tongue and flavors

dependent on the body and tangibles

dependent on the mind and mind objects

so now he's saying in reference to

everything we just talked about

with regards to the ear and sounds

the same process happens

with regards to the nose and odors the

same process happens with regard to

taste in the tongue the same process can

happen with regard to the body and

tangibles

temperature and pressure and so on the

same thing can happen

and with regard to mind objects what

what could be mind objects

what did we talk about yesterday what

kind of mind objects can arise

hindrances can arise

enlightenment factors can arise the four

noble truths the understanding of the

four noble truths can arise

loving kindness can arise equanimity can

arise

thoughts in general can rise

so mind objects right dependent on the

mind and mind objects mind consciousness

arises

the meeting of the three is contact

let's simplify that understanding and

say there is the mind

and there is the mind object which is a

loving-kindness

and dependent upon those there is the

mental awareness of that

and now there is contact with the

loving-kindness

and then there is the feeling of

lovingkindness that arises

and there is the perception that what is

present is loving-kindness

what one perceives that one thinks about

that thinking about remember that's very

key here

what one thinks about what one thing's

about in relation to a sense of self

so when you meditate do you say this is

my loving kindness i am feeling loving

kindness

oh the loving kindness went away

something is wrong

or when you have the quiet mind

i am in quiet mind

my mind is quiet

this is my quiet mind

and so on

that's the thinking about there

and then thinking about there that

there is mental proliferation

that's where the trouble is

because as soon as you identify with any

of the objects you need to you want to

hold on to them you need to hold on to

them because the sense of self is

dependent upon them

and it feels like it needs to cling to

it it feels like it needs to survive its

survival depends upon it

so you feel terrible when it goes away

you have agitation when it goes away

but if you just see everything as an

impersonal process even the meditation

objects

even the process of meditation

then it's like just watching a movie

you don't get so engrossed in it you

realize oh i'm just watching all this

happening

this happens through that metacognition

you're just watching mind have an

experience

you're watching mind meditate

you are not meditating

you are not the meditation you are not

the meditator

there is just an obser observation of

mind

experiencing loving kindness

there is an observation of mind being

quiet

there is an observation of mind

being in the signless collectedness of

mind

there is an observation of mind being

equanimous

being joyful and so on

this is true

meditation true mindfulness

[Music]

so what one has mentally proliferation

proliferated as the source perceptions

with no perceptions and notions born

from their proliferation beset a person

with respect to past future and present

mind objects cognizable through the mind

this is what we just talked about

but now he says

he adds further to this he says when

there is the i

a form and i consciousness

it is possible to point out the

manifestation of contact

so you have the eye

you have the objects let's say that's me

and you have the awareness of the eye

right the light bounces off of me and

you're seeing me

and now there is the manifestation of

contact

but let's say you close your eyes

so now the eye is there

the form is there but there's no

awareness of the eye

and so there is no contact

if you close your eyes you can't see me

so there is no manifestation of contact

there

when there is the manifestation of

contact it is possible to point out the

manifestation of feeling

when there is the manifestation of

feeling it is possible to point out the

manifestation of perception

when there is the manifestation of

perception it is possible to point out

the manifestation of

thinking here it is possible to point

out the manifestation of thinking that

thinking again

the sense of self the the

the equating to that experience with a

sense of self is only possible when

there is an experience

the sense of self is dependent upon

having an experience

the experiencer

arises dependent upon the experience

the seer the hearer

the thinker

the cognizer

that arises dependent upon the sight

the sound

the thought

the object of cognition

so that's the only way that thinking can

arise

when there is the manifestation of

thinking it is possible to point out the

manifestation

of besetment by perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

so in other words it is possible to

point these out

in other words it is possible to

recognize when these happen

when there is contact you can recognize

that contact

when there is feeling you can recognize

that feeling

when there is craving

when there is a thinking about this in

relation to a self you can point that

out you can recognize that if you can

recognize it you can release it you can

relax it you can

re-smile you can return back to an

object that is wholesome

not identified

with a sense of self

so in other words you can recognize

contact you can recognize feeling you

can recognize perception you can

recognize craving an aversion you can

recognize clinging and you can recognize

becoming

and of course birth of action and the

whole mass of suffering

if you can recognize these things you

can let go of them up up to a point up

to the birth of action and i'll talk

about that when we talk about dependent

origination

yeah

um i have embarrassment

arising right now oh my butter feels

like it's about to burst yeah

can i use the restroom go ahead

would you say that again about the

thinker arising only

once the thought arises right so the

experience the sense of the self is

dependent upon the experience

when there is an experience when there

is a thought when there is a cognition

when there is a sight when there is a

sound when there is any of these there

is a sense of self that arises in

dependence

independence on it

on that experience

in other words the mind

is prone

to superimpose a sense of self to the

experience

it's not because there is an experiencer

that there is an experience

the experience is there

whether you know it or not but the

superimposition of a sense of self gives

rise to the idea

of an experiencer

now he says

when there is no i no form and no i

consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of contact that makes

sense

right if the i is not present but there

is forms and there won't be any

consciousness there can't be any contact

when there is no manifestation of

contact it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of feeling

when there is no manifestation of

feeling it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of perception when

there is no manifestation of perception

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of thinking

when there is no manifestation

of thinking

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetmint by

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

so there's a couple of ways to

understand this

one is the cessation of perception

feeling and consciousness

when there is the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

even though

the sense bases are present

even though the sense objects

the objects of those senses are present

there is no consciousness the link

between the two

to give rise to any kind of contact

and therefore there is no rise of

feeling or perception

so when you are in the cessation

or when there is rather the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

there can be no suffering

there can be no potential for suffering

that's the cessation of all conditions

there the mind is unconditioned

and then when the mind is unconditioned

the first initial spark of when the mind

comes back up

there is an experience of that

unconditioned for that moment that

contact

and then there is the experience there

is that feeling born from contact with

the unconditioned

now

when that feeling arises

if there is a thinking about that

experience

if there is a sense of self

tied to that experience of that joy and

that relief someone might experience the

mind experiences after having

experienced nibana

[Music]

then there is mental proliferation so

then that means some of the feathers are

still present

some have dropped and some are still

present

when there is no thinking about the

experience and there is just the

experience

then the feathers drop because there's

no conceit there

and depending upon that conceit the

restlessness goes away the craving for

existence goes away the ignorance goes

away

so he says the same thing he says when

there is no ear no sound and no your

consciousness

when there is no nose no order and no

nose consciousness when there is no

tongue no flavor and no tongue

consciousness when there is no body no

tangible and no body consciousness when

there is no mind no mind object and no

mind consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetting by

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is bhikkhu

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset one

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust of the underlying

tendency to aversion of the underlying

tendency to views of the underlying

tendency to doubt of the underlying

tendency to conceit of the underlying

tendency to desire for being of the

underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to rods and

weapons of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here

these evil unwholesome states cease

without remainder

so in other words the second

understanding of that is yes

in the fully awakened mind in the fully

realized mind there is still contact

so it is still possible

to point out the manifestation of

contact the manifestation of feeling the

manifestation of perception

but because that fully awakened mind no

longer has any conceit no longer has

that self image which it relates that

self to an experience

there is no more mental proliferation

nibana itself one of the synonyms for

nibana

is

nipa pancha

which means

no mental proliferation

that's the mind of the fully awakened

mind that's that's the experience of the

fully awakened mind

it does not relate to everything from a

sense of self

it doesn't have any mental proliferation

of anything so nibana is understood as

that initial experience of the

unconditioned

and also the mind of the araha

because there is

a mind without craving there

right there's no craving there's no

sense of self there's no conceit there's

no ignorance there's no views there's no

doubt there's no

relating to it with a sense of self so

there can be no more suffering

i understand the detailed meaning of

this summary to be thus now friends if

you wish go to the blessed one and ask

him about the meaning of this as the

blessed one explains it to you

so you should remember it

then the bhikkhus having delighted and

rejoiced in the venerable maha kachana's

words rose from their seats and went to

the blessed one

after paying homage to him they sat down

at one side and told the blessed one all

that had taken place after he had left

adding

then the venerable sir then venerable

sir

we went to the venerable mahakachana and

asked him about the meaning the

venerable mahaka-chana expounded the

meaning to us with these terms

statements and phrases

and so the

buddha says mahaka-chana is wise because

mahaka chana has great wisdom

if you had asked me the meaning of this

i would have explained it to you

in the same way that mahaka chana has

explained it

such is the meaning of this and so you

should remember it

when he says that someone is wise or has

great wisdom

what he's saying is that someone has had

a full understanding

of dependent origination

they have fully realized for themselves

how dependent origination works

and it doesn't mean that they have

analyzed it it means they have

experienced it

when they have seen it it means they

have actually

understood it through

experience of how the links of dependent

origination arise and pass away

and so from that experience they become

wise

and they have why a great wisdom

when this was said the venerable ananda

went to the blessed one

and said to him venerable sir just as if

a man exhausted by hunger and weakness

came upon a honey ball

wherever he would taste it he would find

a sweet delectable flavor honey ball

what is a honey ball it was some kind of

a dessert back then

you know it

the equivalent of that would be today

gulab jamun in indian desserts you know

i don't know if you've ever had gulab

jamun but it tastes pretty good

so too venerable sir any able-minded

bhikkhu

wherever he might

scrutinize with wisdom the meaning of

this discourse on the dhamma would find

satisfaction and confidence of mind

venerable sir what is the name of this

discourse on the dhamma

as to that ananda you may remember this

discourse on the dhamma as the honeyball

discourse

that is what the blessed one said the

venerable ananda was satisfied and

delighted in the blessed one's words

any questions

it seemed that

there were

the five aggregates except instead of

formations he was using the word dots

so the five aggregates there yeah we

have um feeling perception

and intention so the intention there are

the formations

and consciousness

so body obviously is there and so on but

the the five aggregates are actually at

the level of mentality materiality

nama rupa which are the faculties

through which the process of contact can

happen

the process of feeling can happen the

process of perception can happen

the process of intention can happen so

if the intention

the intention here is not just like i

want to do this but just the thought the

idea is rooted in the sense of self

rooted in the idea that this is me this

is mine this is myself that is the

thinking about that we're talking about

and the attention is the cognizing of

that experience that is the

consciousness related to

the eye the ear the nose and so on

yes that's right

so the the the

the stopping of the flow of mental

proliferation is facilitated by using

right effort which are the six r's

which is recognizing that there is

proliferation recognizing there is an

identification with this experience

releasing your attention from it

relaxing and then re-smiling and

returning

but there was a lot there said yeah i

feel like what i said was very short

[Laughter]

well what he's doing is he's breaking it

down into different steps

and these steps happen very quickly

so the steps that he was breaking it

down into was the contact

right so you the the initial spark of

the eye and the form

the feeling the actual experience of

seeing whatever it is that you're seeing

and then the perception which is the

cogniti recognizing a recognition of

what it is that you're seeing like if

i'm seeing the color red

i'm recognizing that that's red

and then i think about it and i say

oh i i like red red is my favorite color

or i don't like red and then that that

whole idea of identifying with that

experience is the thinking about

yes because one is that you realize that

this is all impersonal in the first case

when you become a solar panel when

somebody attains

stream entry they have let go of the

idea of

or the view the intellectual view of a

personal self

they realize oh this is all impersonal

it's happening because of a series of

processes they see it for themselves

and then

they start to recognize these different

components these different links

as a result of that so in their

day-to-day life they realize oh here's

the feeling here's the experience right

now it just happens automatically they

don't have to think about it they

realize oh

here's the perception oh here's the

craving and as soon as you recognize the

craving you can start letting it go and

as you get through each of the

attainments it becomes clearer and

clearer and clearer and so as it becomes

clearer and clearer and clearer there is

reduced craving until there is no more

craving until there is no more ignorance

and there is no more suffering

so it's a reduction of suffering through

these attainments

all right

let's share some merit

my suffering ones be suffering free may

the fear struck fearless be may the

grieving shed all grief and may all

beings find relief

may all beings share this merit that we

have thus acquired for the acquisition

of all kinds of happiness may beings

inhabiting space and earth devas and

nagas of mighty power share this merit

of ours may they long protect the

buddha's dispensation

you

me

[Music]

so today we are going to be reading from

majamanikaya 18

madhu pindika suta the honey ball

thus have i heard on one occasion the

blessed one was living in the sakyan

country at kapalavatu in negrodus park

kapalavatu was

the buddha's

birthplace or place where he grew up

and

that is now located in modern day nepal

then when it was morning the blessed one

dressed and taking his bowl and outer

robe went into kapalavatu for alms

when he had wandered for arms in

kapalavatu and had returned from his

arms round

after his meal he went to the great wood

for the days abiding

and entering the great wood sat down at

the root of a bilva

sapling for the days abiding

the day's abiding that is what you guys

are doing all day long meditating

so that could be four hours that could

be six hours that could be eight hours

it could be twelve hours

while walking and wandering for exercise

also went to the great wood

and when he had entered the great wood

he went to the bilva sapling where the

blessed one was and exchange great

greetings with him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished

he stood at one side leaning on his stok

stick

and asked the blessed one

what does the recluse assert what does

he proclaim

dandapani

he was this

well

he was the buddha's father-in-law

and he had a

chip on his shoulder because obviously

the buddha when he was the bodhisattva

left you know in the middle of the night

his wife who was stunned upon his

daughter

and the one the reason why he's called

dandapani is because he had this great

golden stick

danda means stick

and he would walk around with that stick

and

later on when the buddha's cousin

devadat

devadatta

created the schism

dandapani decided to side

with devadatta

so

he always didn't like the buddha for

for many different reasons

so when he says what does the recluse

assert what does he proclaim

really what he's saying is what are you

about you know he's he's being rude to

the buddha obnoxious to the buddha

what are you talking about you know that

kind of attitude what do you know

so the buddha says

friend

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way

that one does not quarrel with anyone in

the world with its gods

its maras and its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas

its princes and its people

in such a way that perceptions no more

underlie that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity

shorn of worry

free from craving

for any kind of being

so let's separate that statement a

little bit because this whole suta is

actually an elaboration of that

statement but i'll give you a little

brief understanding of what he's saying

here

first and foremost he says

i assert and proclaim my teaching in

such a way that one does not quarrel

with anyone in this world

it's a direct answer to dhandapani who

is looking to argue with the buddha

who's looking to debate with the buddha

who's looking to

quarrel with the buddha

and the buddha says that my teaching is

such that i don't quarrel with anyone

my teaching is not for debating

my teaching the dhamma

is not for having arguments about what

is right and what is wrong

what is the dhamma and what is not the

dhamma

so he teaches in such a way

that perceptions no more underlie that

brahman

when he says brahman he's not talking

about the brahmanas in terms of the

priest class

of ancient india

he's talking about the brahman from what

it means really the word brahman what it

means to be realized to be awakened so

the awakened one the buddha he's

referring to himself

or in arahat

the brahmana

so the perceptions the sensual

perceptions or let's say this

perceptions in general no more underlie

that person who abides detached from

sensual pleasures

he no longer has sensual craving

without perplexity

he no longer has doubt the fetter of

doubt

shorn of worry he no longer has any kind

of restlessness

and free from craving for any kind of

being

so this is just a summation a summary

of having destroyed all ten fetters

let go of any kind of doubt

let go of any sensual craving and in

turn any kind of aversion

let go of restlessness let go of conceit

let go of all views

and let go of any craving for existence

or non-existence

when this was said dandapani the sakyan

what do you think dhandarpani would have

done when he heard this

he shook his head

wagged his tongue

and raised his eyebrows until his

forehead was puckered in three lines

then he departed leaning on his stick so

obviously he wasn't happy with that

answer

then when it was evening the blessed one

rose from meditation and went to

negrodus park

where he sat down on a seat made ready

for him

and told the bakus what had taken place

then a certain bhikkhu asked the blessed

one

but venerable sir how does the blessed

one assert and proclaim his teaching in

such a way

that he does not quarrel with anyone in

this world with its gods its maras and

its brahmas

in this generation with its recluses and

brahmanas its princes and its people

and venerable sir

how is it that perceptions no more

underlie the blessed one that brahman

who abides detached from sensual

pleasures

without perplexity shorn of worry

free from craving for any kind of being

now listen to what he says

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust

of the underlying tendency to aversion

of the underlying tendency to views

of the underlying tendency to doubt

of the underlying tendency to conceit

of the underlying tendency to desire for

being

of the underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to

rods and weapons

of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here these evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder

so he says

[Music]

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

beset a person

so

how does mental proliferation arise

first of all what is mental

proliferation

mental proliferation is that example

that venerable metananda gave us

yesterday where he was thinking about

something and then it led to another

thought and then it led to another

thought and then led to another thought

and now you're all over the place you're

clinging to this side here you're

clinging to that idea

and you want to do this you want to do

that and then there's bhava and then

that could lead to some kind of birth of

action

so mental proliferation is three part

it's the initial craving that arises

right so that craving that we talk about

the link of craving

that arises dependent upon feeling

so that craving can be

sensual craving you hear something and

that triggers a memory

and then you cling to that memory so

that's the clinging and you think about

that memory and you say oh yeah i was

this in that memory or i wonder what

would happen if we did it differently

you know all of these thoughts that

arise so that's the bhava that's the

becoming

or it could be craving for existence or

craving for non-existence now any of

these types of craving are dependent

upon feeling

now in that feeling we have threefold

right there's three kinds of feeling

there's pleasant feeling

there's painful feeling and there's

neither painful nor pleasant feeling

these are the three tones of any kind of

experience

so

when there is a pleasant feeling

right you see something beautiful

you hear something wonderful

you taste something delicious

you smell something fragrant

you have a very comfortable sitting

posture it's all very pleasant

if you identify with that experience

if you take that experience personally

that pleasant experience

what can arise as a result

in that is the underlying tendency

to craving

this is the bridge these underlying

tendencies that we talked about now he

just talked about the seven underlying

tendencies

these underlie an experience

pleasant painful or neutral

so if it's pleasant it can give rise

if you identify with it

if you say this is me

this is mine this is myself the

underlying tendency to craving that's

that branch

that goes into full-blown link of

craving

that is where the the mental

proliferation begins

if it's a painful feeling

and you say i don't like it the initial

reaction in the mind is

oh i don't like this this is

uncomfortable

and then there's this taking it

personally the taking of it personally

what does that mean the taking of it

personally

how do you identify with something how

do you identify with a sensation

how do you identify with an experience

how does that happen

there's a sense of self-image that you

have

you create this idea that this is who i

am

you create this story in your mind of

this is me

these are my experiences these are my

memories

and you consolidate them into some kind

of sense of self

and this is always there this is the

underlying tendency to conceit

it's always there for somebody who is

not fully realized

and that underlying tendency to conceit

that's what says

that's what compares and contrasts all

the experiences

and the litmus test

right the the touchstone

is that sense of self that image that

you have about yourself

and then every experience is said to be

oh how does this affect that me

how does it affect the sense of me

and so if it says it's pleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

craving if it says it's unpleasant to me

there's the underlying tendency to

aversion

if it says

it's neutral i don't care about it there

can be the underlying tendency to

ignorance

now whether it's ignorance

or towards views

or doubt or conceit or the desire for

being

these can underlie

pleasant feeling painful feeling

or even neutral feeling

how how does the underlying tendency to

ignorance come about

the very fact that you take this thing

personally this experience personally

whether the experience is a sensory

experience

whether this experience is a meditative

experience whether this experience is

you know some imagination in your mind

whatever it might be

when you have that sense of self that

intrinsic sense of self of taking it

personally

that is where the conceit the underlying

tendency to conceit is

dependent upon that depending upon what

kind of feeling it is there can be the

underlying tendency to ignorance

what is ignorance

ignorance is

not being aware of the four noble truths

forgetting to six are

because

what are the four noble truths that

there is suffering

that there is a source or origin of this

suffering

that there is a cessation of that

suffering

and that there is a way leading to the

cessation of that suffering

now you have a pleasant feeling

or you have a hindrance that arises

you take that hindrance personally and

you say you judge yourself and you say

why am i feeling

this sensual craving or i don't like

that i'm feeling this way

or i don't like this particular

hindrance

and now you have mental proliferation

you have self-doubt which creates more

self-doubt

you have restlessness which creates more

restlessness every time you take it

personally

but if you recognize

the hindrance

that is recognizing the first noble

truth of suffering this hindrance is the

suffering

and then you release your attention from

that the undue attention to that

hindrance in the form of clinging to it

in the form of wanting to push it away

in the form of taking it personally

staying there the undo attention feeds

that hindrance further

so that is a type of craving that

reactivity to that you release that

you relax

when you relax

your mind becomes

free of any kind of craving

so it experiences

the third noble truth

of the cessation of craving which is the

cessation of suffering

then you come back to the smile and then

you come back to the object

this coming back to the smile coming

back to the object is the fourth noble

truth

the cultivation of the way leading

to the cessation of suffering

that is the eightfold path

because the six hours

is right effort

and right effort

is the core of the eightfold path

it is through right effort that you go

from the wrong view to right view

the wrong intention to right intention

the wrong speech to right speech

the wrong action to right action

the wrong livelihood to right livelihood

the wrong mindfulness to right

mindfulness

the wrong collectedness to right

collectiveness so using the six r's

at the experience whatever that

experience is

if you notice that the mind is clinging

to that experience if you notice that

the mind is becoming

engrossed in that experience identifying

with that experience

you recognize that

release your attention from that

relax

re-smile and return back

to that wholesome mindset

what about the underlying tendency to

doubts the underlying tendency to doubt

is about doubt in reference to what is

wholesome and what is unwholesome

what is the right path and what is the

wrong path

so

if there is an experience you might have

confusion about what to do with that

that's the perplexity am i meditating

am i in the first jhana

or am i in the seventh genre

am i experience equanimity

do i have a hindrance

i wonder if i'm doing this correctly

do i remember the instructions that were

given

all of these kinds of thoughts

this is the kind of underlying tendency

to doubt

right so there's an experience that you

have in meditation and you think wait is

this the right thing that i should be is

this the loving kindness that they were

talking about is this the equanimity

that i'm supposed to experience

all of these are the this is the

hindrance of doubt

right so let go of that let the

meditation flow stop trying to analyze

what's going on

stop trying to unnecessarily investigate

what's going on

the true understanding of investigation

of states is the understanding of what

is present and what is not present

what is present and what is not present

meaning you understand okay there is

present right now doubt

or there is present right now craving or

there is present right now

loving-kindness that's it

if there is doubt if there is craving if

there is restlessness

you six are

and come back to your object of

meditation what about views underlying

tendency to views

these views are about

you know

self-use

i am this or i am that

or this is me or this is mine

right this is related to conceit but

this is also related to self-view and

other kinds of wrong views

you know you kind of you try to justify

why is this there

you try to justify or analyze why is it

present why is it not present

right and then there's also underlying

tendencies to view in terms of if

something pleasant happen you'll say

oh i just got lucky

you know or you'll you'll identify with

it and say

oh i i don't know how this happened you

know there are these different kinds of

views that arise in reference to

feeling in reference to perception in

reference to the world and in reference

to self we'll talk about that when we

talk about clinging to views

right so it's a clinging to wrong kinds

of view

wrong kinds of view with the idea that

this was faded to happen that's a kind

of wrong view or the wrong view that i

have to do something about this by

purifying my karma

that's a ascetic kind of view

or there's nothing wrong with what i'm

doing even though you know it to be

wrong

there's that little nudge in your mind

that says this is probably not what you

should be doing and you'll say oh it's

no big deal nobody has to know

that's a different kind of wrong view

because you think oh nothing really

matters there's no

there's no karma here there's no cause

and consequence here that's a different

kind of wrong view

so these are the different kinds of

underlying tendency to views

what about the underlying tendency

to

the desire for being

the underlying tendency

to desire for being

that's

that means the desire to exist in a

certain kind of way

you have a pleasant feeling and you say

i hope this feeling doesn't stop

you experience loving kindness and you

say

i hope i can stay with this loving

kindness

as soon as a loving kindness fades away

you say what

happened you know i you try to hold on

to that

in this meditation you don't hold on to

anything

the objective is not to hold on to

anything

the object of meditation is a

is a

is a means for your mind to be stable

it's a means for your mind to be

collected to be centered

so which means that you're just using it

to let your mind be collected

the unification of mind

anything beyond that where you try to

hold on to the object

is a underlying tendency to desire for

being

[Music]

so joy comes up and you say oh the joy

dissipated i must be doing something

wrong

right so let go of any attachment to how

things should be

or how things should not be that's

another kind of desire for being

right it's like

i don't want to be in this particular

retreat or i don't want to be doing this

or i don't want to be doing that i don't

want to be

that's the beginning of desire for

non-existence

so let go of attachment to any kind of

experience

in this retreat make it a point to just

allow experiences to flow

without identifying with them

be like that

you know that audience who's just

watching a movie just playing out

a movie

don't get caught up in what's going on

in the movie

the movie may be interesting maybe

pleasant maybe unpleasant

you know it might be a romance it might

be a drama it might be a comedy it might

be a horror

whatever kind of film it is

just watch it

don't get engrossed in it

right it's just a movie just watch

everything as it is

without identifying with it without

supplanting that sense of this is me

this is mine this is myself

to that experience

whether it's right now

or whether it's when you're meditating

just let everything

flow as soon as you try to hold on to it

there the craving arises that's the

underlying tendency that gives rise to

the full-blown craving and that craving

then gives rise to clinging and that

clinging gives rise to becoming and

these three

are what constitute that mental

proliferation

mental proliferation comes from the word

papancha

prapancha prapancha in excuse me in

sanskrit

and prapancha is also known as like a

vortex

you're getting caught up in this vortex

of thoughts

getting caught up in the hurricane or

tornado of thoughts

your your goal here your objective here

is not to get caught up

in the whirlwind

but to be in the eye of the storm

to be in the eye of the storm you become

very still

everything else around you moves

but your mind doesn't go here there or

whatever it's doing it just stays

here

so when you don't have these underlying

tendencies

then it says that is the end

of resorting to rods and weapons of

quarrels brawls disputes recrimination

malicious words and false speech

here these are evil unwholesome states

cease without remainder why is this

because when you have that sense of self

that self image that's always there when

the conceit is there you still have

something to prove

you still have something to defend

you still have something to say oh this

is wrong

or this is right according to my sense

of self

and so when you have to defend your view

when you have to defend your sense of

self

there arises

you know quarrels arguments

and from that sense of self they can

arise even violence

right taking up of the stick and sword

as he puts it or with that sense of self

you have something to prove or you have

something to gain from that sense of

self and sometimes you'll use deceit to

get that and so you use false speech

so this sense of self the self image

that you have

try to figure out what that is

write down in your you know in your

journal at some point and think

what is myself

who is this that i am

that i think i am

and write it all down

and realize that in that in those

moments you are not that it just arises

and passes away

the idea of who you think you are

is just a little fragment it's just a

little frame

an ever moving series of frames

but as soon as you hold on to that as

soon as you make that concrete

as soon as you freeze that frame that's

where the trouble begins

[Music]

that's where you defend some sense of

self

that's where you identify with some

sense of self

that is what the blessed one said having

said this the sublime one rose from his

seat and went into his dwelling

then soon after the blessed one had gone

the bhikkhus considered

now friends the blessed one has risen

from his seat and gone into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief

without expanding the detail meaning

now who will expound this in detail

he should have asked some questions

before he left

then they considered

the venerable maha kachana

is praised by the teacher and esteemed

by his wise companions in the holy life

he is capable of expounding the detailed

meaning

suppose we went to him

and asked him the meaning of this now

maha kachana was a great

uh

well he was an arahat for one and he was

a great expounder of a lot of things

that were said in brief

so there's a series of sutas in the

majaminikaya where mahakachana

gives

a very

detailed meaning of things that are said

in brief

and so he's known as the great expounder

you know the great elaborator the one

who breaks things down

and he's also somebody who

always talked about things in relation

to consciousness

so we'll talk about what he's we'll see

what he does in this particular suta

then the bhikkhus went to the venerable

mahakachana and exchanged greetings with

him

when this courteous and amiable talk was

finished they sat down to one side and

told him what had taken place adding

let the venerable mahaka-chana expound

it to us

so what do you think mahaka-chan is

going to say here

he says

friends

it is as though a man needing heartwood

seeking heartwood

wandering in search of heartwood

thought that heartwood should be sought

for

for among the branches and leaves of a

great tree standing possessed of

heartwood

after he had passed over the root and

the trunk

so in other words you're looking for the

core right you're looking for the core

of this tree but you're looking at it in

the branches in the trunk

and so it is with you venerable sirs

that you think that i should be asked

about the meaning of this

after you passed the blessed one by when

you were face to face with the teacher

in other words

why didn't you ask him questions

you had your chance

he was there

you should have asked him questions

nevertheless this is what mahakasha says

for knowing the blessed one knows seeing

he sees

he is vision he is knowledge he is the

he is the holy one he is the sayer the

proclaimer the elucidator of meaning the

giver of the deathless the lord of the

dama the

that was the time when you should have

asked the blessed one the meeting

as he told you so you should have

remembered it

[Music]

so this is what

the bhikkhu said

surely friend kachana knowing the

blessed one knows seeing he sees he is

vision the tata and so on that was the

time when we should have asked the

blessed one the meaning

as he told us so we should have

remembered it

yet the venerable mahaka chana is

praised by the teacher and esteemed by

his wise companions in the holy life

the venerable mahaka-chana is capable of

expounding the detailed meaning of the

summary given in brief

by the blessed one without expounding

the detailed meaning

let the venerable maha kachana expound

it without finding it troublesome

so in other words please

give us the answer here expound it for

us

you know

so mahakachana relents and he says all

right i'll do it he says then listen

friends and attend closely to what i

shall say

yes friend the bikus replied

the venerable maha kachana said this

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is because as to the source through

which perceptions and notions born of

mental proliferation beset a person

if nothing is found there to delight and

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendencies this is the end of resorting

to rods and weapons here these evil

unwholesome states cease without

remainder

i understand the detail meaning of it to

be as follows

now listen carefully

dependent on the i and forms i

consciousness arises

the meaning of the three is contact

what with contact as condition there is

feeling

what one feels that one perceives

what one perceives that one thinks about

what one thinks about that one mentally

proliferates

with what one mentally proliferated as

the source

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation beset a

person

with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the eye

let's break this down

dependent upon the eye and forms

so there is the eye

and there are colors and shapes and

patterns and forms

the light

bounces off these patterns these shapes

these forms

and then that light those photons

hit the retina in the eye

so dependent upon the eye and those

forms

there is i consciousness

what is i consciousness that is to say

the i consciousness

eye consciousness is the awareness of

the eye awareness of the experience of

the eye

the cognizing

of the experience

when you have these three

there is contact

for someone who is blind

there is no eye consciousness

they are not cognizing the eye they are

not able to be aware of the experience

of the eyes

so if there is no eye consciousness

and there is light there is form there

are shapes there's colors there's

patterns

and the light bounces off that uh

bounces off them and hits the retina

makes contact with the retina but

there's no consciousness there right

because for a blind person it's not

there

then there won't be contact

contact needs these three

it needs the sense base

it needs the object of that sun space

and it needs the consciousness of that

particular sense space these three

constitute

contact

what does contact mean

contact comes from the pali word

fasa or in sanskrit that is spursha

spurshad literally means to touch

so when they touch

there is the meeting right there is the

meeting of i and forms

and dependent upon that experience

depending upon that initial spark of

contact

there is feeling

so what is that feeling

that is seeing

the vision

of what it is that you are feeling

what one feels that one perceives

with feeling there is perception

what is perception

perception

is rooted in memory

when you were in school

when you were in kindergarten in the

first grade you learned about patterns

you learn about shapes you learned about

colors you learned about the seasons you

learned about how to tell time you

learned about the months you learned

about the days of the week you learned

about the alphabet you learn how to

write you learn how to spell

right you cognized you experienced all

of these things you were learning all of

these things

and then they became part of your memory

so now when you see

the color red your mind immediately

sees that is the color red the color

itself

makes contact with the eye

there is the eye consciousness

which then gives rise to the contact

and then you see

that color

the knowing of what that color is that

is to say that that is red is perception

it is the labeling it is the it's the

knowing

it's the

mind that says i know what this is it's

the mind that recognizes

that

recognizes what it initially cognized

what it initially learned

when you put your hand on the stove

right the first time you put it you're

curious and say what is this immediately

you feel heat

and now you know what heat feels like

you stay a little longer and it hurts

and yeah you recognize that as a painful

feeling

so next time you're at the stove fire

you will be careful

because you see the stove fire and you

perceive it to be hot and potentially

painful

that perception is the knowing the

recognition

that that fire is hot and that fire can

be painful

so it's rooted in memory

what one perceives that one thinks about

now this is very important to understand

what does that mean what one thinks

about

when one has a relationship with it in

terms of a sense of self

that is the taking it personally

that is

seeing it or experiencing it

and comparing it from a sense of self

that self image

how does this affect that me

how does it benefit me

is it mine

is it me

is it myself

that is the thinking about it

that's the underlying tendency

and so what one thinks about that one

mentally proliferates that there is

craving there there is aversion there

there is clinging

there's clinging to views clinging to

that experience clinging to a self-view

right

or clinging to rights and rituals in

regards to that experience and then

there is a becoming you identify with

that further and then create the sense

of self from which you react

this whole process happens like that

but that is the process that is mental

proliferation

in meditation that process seems to slow

down because you become more mindful

you become more aware you become more

collected

what is that collectedness

if there is a bowl of water a clear bowl

of water and there is dirt in there

and it's agitated

there's all these ideas and thoughts

there's all of this mental proliferation

going on

then there's no way for you to be able

to see that mental proliferation you are

in it

the mind is

in it

but the moment you settle down

you sit down for meditation

you clear your mind

you 6r

you let go

and you collect your mind around

something

the dirt in that water settles down

and now you see the clarity of that

so you need that process of settling

down the mind through meditation

through samadhi

and that is preceded and dependent upon

having right mindfulness

being able to recognize your mind being

collected or not collected

and that is predicated upon

right effort

using the six hour process

and that is predicated upon

keeping your precepts

why

because when you do not keep your

precepts when you do break the precepts

there's agitation that arises in the

mind and

it shakes up that water

and you're not able to clearly see but

as you continue to commit to keeping the

precepts

as you commit to keeping

you know all of the

you have the commitment to keep your

precepts but you also have the

commitment

to incline the mind towards nibana

that's the chanda the wholesome desire

then that gives rise to naturally the

right effort naturally right mindfulness

naturally collectedness then that gives

naturally

that gives rise to naturally right

knowledge right wisdom

right insight

and right liberation

so with what one has mentally

proliferated as the source meaning

whatever you've thought about you've

clung to you've craved for you've clung

to you've become that

the perceptions and notions born from

that

beset a person with respect to past

future and present forms cognizable

through the year

so in other words you relate to the

sense of self in relation to the past

in relation to the present in relation

to the future how does that happen

you say this is how it was in the past

and you compare it to what it is now or

when you are staying in the present

moment with the sense of self you say

this is who i am or this is mine or this

is me

and when you think about into the future

that can give rise to anxiety

how will it affect me

will it be good for me will it be bad

for me

how should i plan this how should i do

that

all of these kinds of mental

proliferation arise

so

he says the same for this

dependent amount upon the year and the

sounds dependent on the nose and odors

dependent on the tongue and flavors

dependent on the body and tangibles

dependent on the mind and mind objects

so now he's saying in reference to

everything we just talked about

with regards to the ear and sounds

the same process happens

with regards to the nose and odors the

same process happens with regard to

taste in the tongue the same process can

happen with regard to the body and

tangibles

temperature and pressure and so on the

same thing can happen

and with regard to mind objects what

what could be mind objects

what did we talk about yesterday what

kind of mind objects can arise

hindrances can arise

enlightenment factors can arise the four

noble truths the understanding of the

four noble truths can arise

loving kindness can arise equanimity can

arise

thoughts in general can rise

so mind objects right dependent on the

mind and mind objects mind consciousness

arises

the meeting of the three is contact

let's simplify that understanding and

say there is the mind

and there is the mind object which is a

loving-kindness

and dependent upon those there is the

mental awareness of that

and now there is contact with the

loving-kindness

and then there is the feeling of

lovingkindness that arises

and there is the perception that what is

present is loving-kindness

what one perceives that one thinks about

that thinking about remember that's very

key here

what one thinks about what one thing's

about in relation to a sense of self

so when you meditate do you say this is

my loving kindness i am feeling loving

kindness

oh the loving kindness went away

something is wrong

or when you have the quiet mind

i am in quiet mind

my mind is quiet

this is my quiet mind

and so on

that's the thinking about there

and then thinking about there that

there is mental proliferation

that's where the trouble is

because as soon as you identify with any

of the objects you need to you want to

hold on to them you need to hold on to

them because the sense of self is

dependent upon them

and it feels like it needs to cling to

it it feels like it needs to survive its

survival depends upon it

so you feel terrible when it goes away

you have agitation when it goes away

but if you just see everything as an

impersonal process even the meditation

objects

even the process of meditation

then it's like just watching a movie

you don't get so engrossed in it you

realize oh i'm just watching all this

happening

this happens through that metacognition

you're just watching mind have an

experience

you're watching mind meditate

you are not meditating

you are not the meditation you are not

the meditator

there is just an obser observation of

mind

experiencing loving kindness

there is an observation of mind being

quiet

there is an observation of mind

being in the signless collectedness of

mind

there is an observation of mind being

equanimous

being joyful and so on

this is true

meditation true mindfulness

[Music]

so what one has mentally proliferation

proliferated as the source perceptions

with no perceptions and notions born

from their proliferation beset a person

with respect to past future and present

mind objects cognizable through the mind

this is what we just talked about

but now he says

he adds further to this he says when

there is the i

a form and i consciousness

it is possible to point out the

manifestation of contact

so you have the eye

you have the objects let's say that's me

and you have the awareness of the eye

right the light bounces off of me and

you're seeing me

and now there is the manifestation of

contact

but let's say you close your eyes

so now the eye is there

the form is there but there's no

awareness of the eye

and so there is no contact

if you close your eyes you can't see me

so there is no manifestation of contact

there

when there is the manifestation of

contact it is possible to point out the

manifestation of feeling

when there is the manifestation of

feeling it is possible to point out the

manifestation of perception

when there is the manifestation of

perception it is possible to point out

the manifestation of

thinking here it is possible to point

out the manifestation of thinking that

thinking again

the sense of self the the

the equating to that experience with a

sense of self is only possible when

there is an experience

the sense of self is dependent upon

having an experience

the experiencer

arises dependent upon the experience

the seer the hearer

the thinker

the cognizer

that arises dependent upon the sight

the sound

the thought

the object of cognition

so that's the only way that thinking can

arise

when there is the manifestation of

thinking it is possible to point out the

manifestation

of besetment by perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

so in other words it is possible to

point these out

in other words it is possible to

recognize when these happen

when there is contact you can recognize

that contact

when there is feeling you can recognize

that feeling

when there is craving

when there is a thinking about this in

relation to a self you can point that

out you can recognize that if you can

recognize it you can release it you can

relax it you can

re-smile you can return back to an

object that is wholesome

not identified

with a sense of self

so in other words you can recognize

contact you can recognize feeling you

can recognize perception you can

recognize craving an aversion you can

recognize clinging and you can recognize

becoming

and of course birth of action and the

whole mass of suffering

if you can recognize these things you

can let go of them up up to a point up

to the birth of action and i'll talk

about that when we talk about dependent

origination

yeah

um i have embarrassment

arising right now oh my butter feels

like it's about to burst yeah

can i use the restroom go ahead

would you say that again about the

thinker arising only

once the thought arises right so the

experience the sense of the self is

dependent upon the experience

when there is an experience when there

is a thought when there is a cognition

when there is a sight when there is a

sound when there is any of these there

is a sense of self that arises in

dependence

independence on it

on that experience

in other words the mind

is prone

to superimpose a sense of self to the

experience

it's not because there is an experiencer

that there is an experience

the experience is there

whether you know it or not but the

superimposition of a sense of self gives

rise to the idea

of an experiencer

now he says

when there is no i no form and no i

consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of contact that makes

sense

right if the i is not present but there

is forms and there won't be any

consciousness there can't be any contact

when there is no manifestation of

contact it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of feeling

when there is no manifestation of

feeling it is impossible to point out

the manifestation of perception when

there is no manifestation of perception

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of thinking

when there is no manifestation

of thinking

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetmint by

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation

so there's a couple of ways to

understand this

one is the cessation of perception

feeling and consciousness

when there is the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

even though

the sense bases are present

even though the sense objects

the objects of those senses are present

there is no consciousness the link

between the two

to give rise to any kind of contact

and therefore there is no rise of

feeling or perception

so when you are in the cessation

or when there is rather the cessation of

perception feeling and consciousness

there can be no suffering

there can be no potential for suffering

that's the cessation of all conditions

there the mind is unconditioned

and then when the mind is unconditioned

the first initial spark of when the mind

comes back up

there is an experience of that

unconditioned for that moment that

contact

and then there is the experience there

is that feeling born from contact with

the unconditioned

now

when that feeling arises

if there is a thinking about that

experience

if there is a sense of self

tied to that experience of that joy and

that relief someone might experience the

mind experiences after having

experienced nibana

[Music]

then there is mental proliferation so

then that means some of the feathers are

still present

some have dropped and some are still

present

when there is no thinking about the

experience and there is just the

experience

then the feathers drop because there's

no conceit there

and depending upon that conceit the

restlessness goes away the craving for

existence goes away the ignorance goes

away

so he says the same thing he says when

there is no ear no sound and no your

consciousness

when there is no nose no order and no

nose consciousness when there is no

tongue no flavor and no tongue

consciousness when there is no body no

tangible and no body consciousness when

there is no mind no mind object and no

mind consciousness

it is impossible to point out the

manifestation of besetting by

perceptions and notions

born of mental proliferation

friends when the blessed one rose from

his seat and went into his dwelling

after giving a summary in brief without

expounding the detailed meaning

that is bhikkhu

as to the source through which

perceptions and notions born of mental

proliferation beset one

if nothing is found there to delight in

welcome and hold to

this is the end of the underlying

tendency to lust of the underlying

tendency to aversion of the underlying

tendency to views of the underlying

tendency to doubt of the underlying

tendency to conceit of the underlying

tendency to desire for being of the

underlying tendency to ignorance

this is the end of resorting to rods and

weapons of quarrels brawls disputes

recrimination malicious words and false

speech

here

these evil unwholesome states cease

without remainder

so in other words the second

understanding of that is yes

in the fully awakened mind in the fully

realized mind there is still contact

so it is still possible

to point out the manifestation of

contact the manifestation of feeling the

manifestation of perception

but because that fully awakened mind no

longer has any conceit no longer has

that self image which it relates that

self to an experience

there is no more mental proliferation

nibana itself one of the synonyms for

nibana

is

nipa pancha

which means

no mental proliferation

that's the mind of the fully awakened

mind that's that's the experience of the

fully awakened mind

it does not relate to everything from a

sense of self

it doesn't have any mental proliferation

of anything so nibana is understood as

that initial experience of the

unconditioned

and also the mind of the araha

because there is

a mind without craving there

right there's no craving there's no

sense of self there's no conceit there's

no ignorance there's no views there's no

doubt there's no

relating to it with a sense of self so

there can be no more suffering

i understand the detailed meaning of

this summary to be thus now friends if

you wish go to the blessed one and ask

him about the meaning of this as the

blessed one explains it to you

so you should remember it

then the bhikkhus having delighted and

rejoiced in the venerable maha kachana's

words rose from their seats and went to

the blessed one

after paying homage to him they sat down

at one side and told the blessed one all

that had taken place after he had left

adding

then the venerable sir then venerable

sir

we went to the venerable mahakachana and

asked him about the meaning the

venerable mahaka-chana expounded the

meaning to us with these terms

statements and phrases

and so the

buddha says mahaka-chana is wise because

mahaka chana has great wisdom

if you had asked me the meaning of this

i would have explained it to you

in the same way that mahaka chana has

explained it

such is the meaning of this and so you

should remember it

when he says that someone is wise or has

great wisdom

what he's saying is that someone has had

a full understanding

of dependent origination

they have fully realized for themselves

how dependent origination works

and it doesn't mean that they have

analyzed it it means they have

experienced it

when they have seen it it means they

have actually

understood it through

experience of how the links of dependent

origination arise and pass away

and so from that experience they become

wise

and they have why a great wisdom

when this was said the venerable ananda

went to the blessed one

and said to him venerable sir just as if

a man exhausted by hunger and weakness

came upon a honey ball

wherever he would taste it he would find

a sweet delectable flavor honey ball

what is a honey ball it was some kind of

a dessert back then

you know it

the equivalent of that would be today

gulab jamun in indian desserts you know

i don't know if you've ever had gulab

jamun but it tastes pretty good

so too venerable sir any able-minded

bhikkhu

wherever he might

scrutinize with wisdom the meaning of

this discourse on the dhamma would find

satisfaction and confidence of mind

venerable sir what is the name of this

discourse on the dhamma

as to that ananda you may remember this

discourse on the dhamma as the honeyball

discourse

that is what the blessed one said the

venerable ananda was satisfied and

delighted in the blessed one's words

any questions

it seemed that

there were

the five aggregates except instead of

formations he was using the word dots

so the five aggregates there yeah we

have um feeling perception

and intention so the intention there are

the formations

and consciousness

so body obviously is there and so on but

the the five aggregates are actually at

the level of mentality materiality

nama rupa which are the faculties

through which the process of contact can

happen

the process of feeling can happen the

process of perception can happen

the process of intention can happen so

if the intention

the intention here is not just like i

want to do this but just the thought the

idea is rooted in the sense of self

rooted in the idea that this is me this

is mine this is myself that is the

thinking about that we're talking about

and the attention is the cognizing of

that experience that is the

consciousness related to

the eye the ear the nose and so on

yes that's right

so the the the

the stopping of the flow of mental

proliferation is facilitated by using

right effort which are the six r's

which is recognizing that there is

proliferation recognizing there is an

identification with this experience

releasing your attention from it

relaxing and then re-smiling and

returning

but there was a lot there said yeah i

feel like what i said was very short

[Laughter]

well what he's doing is he's breaking it

down into different steps

and these steps happen very quickly

so the steps that he was breaking it

down into was the contact

right so you the the initial spark of

the eye and the form

the feeling the actual experience of

seeing whatever it is that you're seeing

and then the perception which is the

cogniti recognizing a recognition of

what it is that you're seeing like if

i'm seeing the color red

i'm recognizing that that's red

and then i think about it and i say

oh i i like red red is my favorite color

or i don't like red and then that that

whole idea of identifying with that

experience is the thinking about

yes because one is that you realize that

this is all impersonal in the first case

when you become a solar panel when

somebody attains

stream entry they have let go of the

idea of

or the view the intellectual view of a

personal self

they realize oh this is all impersonal

it's happening because of a series of

processes they see it for themselves

and then

they start to recognize these different

components these different links

as a result of that so in their

day-to-day life they realize oh here's

the feeling here's the experience right

now it just happens automatically they

don't have to think about it they

realize oh

here's the perception oh here's the

craving and as soon as you recognize the

craving you can start letting it go and

as you get through each of the

attainments it becomes clearer and

clearer and clearer and so as it becomes

clearer and clearer and clearer there is

reduced craving until there is no more

craving until there is no more ignorance

and there is no more suffering

so it's a reduction of suffering through

these attainments

all right

let's share some merit

my suffering ones be suffering free may

the fear struck fearless be may the

grieving shed all grief and may all

beings find relief

may all beings share this merit that we

have thus acquired for the acquisition

of all kinds of happiness may beings

inhabiting space and earth devas and

nagas of mighty power share this merit

of ours may they long protect the

buddha's dispensation

you