From: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FLMN0GAEAD4

Context: Throughout this transcript, Bhante Vimalaramsi is the speaker unless otherwise indicated.

now there's an interesting thing that

for more than 20 years I was told beyond

a shadow of a doubt even one of one of

the really big meditation teachers of

his time he wrote a book and said you

will never get any higher than third

jhana when you're practicing

loving-kindness meditation you'll never

get any higher than the third jhana with

compassion you'll never get any higher

than the third jhana with joy when you

get to equanimity you'll get to the

fourth jhana now this is what I honestly

believed for twenty more than twenty

years until this book came out actually

and as I was thumbing around in this

book I ran across something that is

quite interesting

connected discourses on page 1607 this

is the awakening factors with

loving-kindness accompanied by

loving-kindness I'm going to read a

little bit of this so that you get an

idea of what the Buddha actually was

talking about

okay on one occasion a blessed one was

dwelling among the colons where there

was a town of the coal ian's named

holida vamsa then in mourning a number

of monks dressed and taking their bowl

and robes entered the town for alms then

it occurred to them it's still too early

to walk for alms in town let us go to

the park of the Wanderers of other sects

then those monks went to the park of the

Wanderers of other sects they exchanged

greetings with the Wanderers and when

they concluded their greetings and

cordial talk sat down at one side The

Wanderers then said to them friends the

ascetic Gautama teaches the dominant to

his disciples thus come monks abandoned

the five hindrances the corruptions of

the mind with that weakened wisdom and

well pervading 1/4 with a mind imbued

with loving-kindness likewise the second

quarter likewise the third and the

fourth

thus above below across and everywhere

and to all as to oneself dwell pervading

the entire world with a mind imbued with

loving kindness vast exalted measureless

without hostility and without ill will

dwell pervading one-quarter of the mind

and buta skom passion likewise the

second third and fourth

thus above below across and everywhere

and to all as to oneself dwell pervading

the entire

world with a mind imbued with compassion

vast exalted measureless without

hostility and without ill will dwell

pervading 1/4 of the mind and brood with

joy now they have in here they call it

altruistic joy that doesn't go along

with the meditation it's just joy

altruistic joy is being being happy and

somebody else's success and that's

that's not it

ok so you go through all the four

quarters and everywhere and it's it's

the same with equanimity we two friends

teach the Dhamma to our disciples thus

come friends abandon the five hindrances

dwell pervading the entire world with a

mind imbued with loving kindness

compassion joy and equanimity without a

will so friends what here is the

distinction the disparity the difference

between the ascetic Gautama and us that

is regarding the one dhamma teaching and

the other regarding the the one the

master of instructions for other sects

then amongst neither delighted nor

rejected the statement of the Wanderers

they were smart without delighting in it

without rejecting it they rose from

their seats and left thinking we shall

learn the meaning of this statement in

the presence of the Blessed One then

when those monks had walk walk for alms

and had returned from the alms round

after their meal they approached to the

Blessed One having paid homage to him

they sat down at one side and reported

to him the entire conversation between

those wanderers and themselves the

buddha said monks when wanderers of

other sects speak thus they should be

asked friends how is the liberation of

mine by loving-kindness developed what

does it have as its destination its

culmination its fruit and the final goal

how is the liberation of mine by

compassion developed and goes through

all the four brahma tiaras

being asked thus those Wanderers would

not be able to reply and further they

would not they would meet with vexation

for what reason

because they would not be within their

domain I do not see any one monks in

this world with its Davis bra Mara and

Brahma in this generation with this

ascetics and Brahmans

its davis and humans who could satisfy

the mind with an answer to those

questions except that to togehter or the

disciples of the two target or one who

has heard it from them and how a monks

is liberated mind by loving-kindness

developed what does it have as its

destination its culmination its fruit

its final goal here monks a monk

develops the awakening factor of

mindfulness accompanied by

loving-kindness and he goes through all

of the awakening factors accompanied by

loving-kindness

then he dwells equanimous Li mindful

clearly comprehending or else he do he

enters and dwells in the deliverance of

the beautiful the beautiful means the

fourth genre as soon as I read that

after 20 years of believing that this

was this was the way it actually was as

soon as I read that I became very

disappointed I've been teaching the

wrong thing for 20 years so I

immediately started changing the way I

was teaching about it

monks the liberation of mine by loving

kindness has the beautiful as its

culmination that's the highest you can

go with loving kindness the fourth jhana

I say for wise monks here who has not

penetrated to a superior liberation okay

that's as far as you go with that

particular one then we go to compassion

and you go through the awakening factors

okay after you do the awakening factors

accompanied by compassion based on

seclusion dispassion and cessation

maturing and release

with the complete transcendence of gross

perceptions of form with the passing

away of gross perceptions of sensory

impact with aware that space is infinite

he enters and dwells in the base of the

infinity of space monks the liberation

of mine by compassion has the base of

infinite space as its culmination I say

for a wise monk here who is not

penetrated to a superior liberation now

what's the liberation by joy

by completely transcending the base of

the infinity of space aware that

consciousness is infinite and when I

started teaching this I got questioned

very heavily and I was with a lot of

very influential people and I started

getting them to read this and their mind

got blown just like my mind did but they

didn't start teaching this way oh I have

so many students that are practicing

this other way I'm not going to change

it's really disappointing to run across

teachers that when they find they make a

mistake that they're not willing to

change it but all my students will come

back and say I taught them wrongly well

yeah that can happen but what really

happens when I started changing is

people started being more and more

successful with it because they were

understanding it as it actually is

but to this day there are some people

that are still teaching the Vasudha

manga you have to go in the ten

directions and you have to say four

different wishes and that's a mental

exercise it's not a real meditation and

the thing that's amazing with this as

you start to go through the different

brahma vihara z' you start to change the

way you see the world and you start

responding with a softer mind so there

is real personality change when you're

doing this and that's very important

so when I went to some of my breweries

friends that were really popular big

monks especially in Burma they're very

famous and started questioning them

about loving-kindness and the different

way of teaching it other than the

Vasudha maha i got shut down even though

i was carrying this book with me and i

showed them this book and i said go to

the equivalent in burmese script and

read it and they still would not change

so I've got a real uphill battle but

I'm a successful teacher I have a lot of

students that have gone through all of

the Brahma VRS they know what they see

it they practice it they go through

personality change they don't have such

heavy-duty emotional upsets and as a

result of that people are starting to

sit up and take notice more and more one

of the things that I want to do is one

of these times and when I'm in

California I want to go to Boulder Creek

and up by Santa Cruz that area anyway

where the heart math people are teaching

loving kindness and they're able to

measure it

because they say oh I can measure

loving-kindness coming from you from 500

feet away well other people can feel it

that are on the other side of the planet

so I want them to be aware of the

difference between the one-pointed

concentration and the twin method the

using the six R's with that relaxed step

because that changes everything

eventually maybe not in my lifetime but

eventually it will change we'll see